Apostrophes with Words and Names Ending in s
The Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation
Apostrophes with Words and Names Ending in s
Whether to use an additional s with singular possession can still be a source of heated debate. This review will help to resolve some of the questions surrounding that subject.
Rule 1: Many common nouns end in the letter s (lens, cactus, bus, etc.). So do a lot of proper nouns (Mr. Jones, Texas, Christmas). There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.
Some writers and editors add ’s to every proper noun, be it Hastings’s or Jones’s. There also are a few who add only an apostrophe to all nouns ending in s; however, this method is typically rare, and not recommended here.
One method, common in newspapers and magazines, is to add an apostrophe plus s (’s) to common nouns ending in s, but only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s.
Examples:
the class’s hours
Mr. Jones’ golf clubs
The canvas’s size
Texas’ weather
Another widely used technique, the one we favor, is to write the word as we would speak it. For example, since most people saying “Mr. Hastings’ pen” would not pronounce an added s, we would write Mr. Hastings’ pen with no added s. On the other hand, most people would pronounce an added s in “Jones’s,” so we’d write it as we say it: Mr. Jones’s golf clubs. This method explains the punctuation of for goodness’ sake.
Rule 2: To show plural possession of a word ending in an s or s sound, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe.
Examples:
the classes’ hours
the Joneses’ car
guys’ night out
two actresses’ roles
Pop Quiz
Place the apostrophe (and perhaps an s) where appropriate.
1. The classes opinions were predictable according to their grade levels.
2. The boss suit was brand new.
3. The bus steering wheel was wearing out.
4. The Crosses dog bit the mailman.
5. We understand Lagos airport handled over one million passengers last year.
6. The Smiths boat sank.
Pop Quiz Answers
1. The classes’ opinions were predictable according to their grade levels.
2. The boss’s suit was brand new.
3. The bus’s steering wheel was wearing out.
4. The Crosses’ dog bit the mailman.
5. We understand Lagos’s (OR Lagos’) airport handled over one million passengers last year.
6. The Smiths’ boat sank.
If the article or the existing discussions do not address a thought or question you have on the subject, please use the "Comment" box at the bottom of this page.
I’m sorry, but Ms. Jones owns a house, hence it is Ms. Jones’ house, etc.
“Joneses” as such states that more than one member of the Jones family is being referred to. Adding (incorrectly) an apostrophe paramount to stating “The hot sun is hot.”
This “new” English or “incorrect English based on general, incorrect usage” is terrible. Or should we all say “He did good” just because so many English speakers use this phrase incorrectly?
One could say “the Jones house” using “Jones” as an adjective. One could also say “I saw the Joneses yesterday” using “Joneses” as a plural. However, one cannot say “the Joneses house” without using an apostrophe. This is a plural possessive so “the Joneses’ house” is correct.
In speaking one would the say phonetically The Joneses house, In writing why would one not write The Jones’s house? It is abundantly clear what is meant by that written term The Joneses’ house is awkward
The Adams house spoken might mean ownership of a house by someone with the surname Adam or Adams,
Why not be absolutely clear about the ownership It’s Adam’s house or it’s the Adams’s house.
As we stated, the Joneses’ is a plural possessive. Writing Jones’s implies one person named Jones. Please see our Rule 1c. of Apostophes for more information.
Your comments regarding “The Adams house” point out the importance of carefully following the rules for singular and plural possession. “The Adams house,” with “Adams” used as an adjective, whether written or spoken, tells us that the house is owned or inhabited by a person or people named Adams. If the surname was “Adam,” then the form would be “The Adam house.”
This is the way to be absolutely clear:
One individual with the first or last name of Adam, then it’s Adam’s house. A family surnamed Adam are collectively the Adams. Their house is the Adams’ house or the Adams’s house.
One individual surnamed Adams, then it’s Adams’ house or Adams’s house. A family surnamed Adams are collectively the Adamses. Their house is the Adamses’ house.
Bob (the dog) has treats. Where would the apostrophe go?
Bobs’ Treats, or
Bob’s Treats.
Thank you
Bob’s treats. Please see our Rule 1a of Apostrophes.
I agree in saying the Joneses house-meaning they all live there. Also, using an apostrophe for possession. The Jones’ house for ownership.
Writing “the Joneses’ house” is a plural possessive and requires an apostrophe. When using the word Jones as an adjective to describe house, as in “the Jones house,” no apostrophe is needed.
How do you make your name, Ellis, plural? My niece is marrying an Ellis and we are ordering a banner, “Soon to be the Ellises.”
Since Karen Ellis may not be monitoring this blog in a timely way, we’d like you to know that your banner is written correctly because a simple plural does not need an apostrophe.
Scott, language is a set of generally accepted guidelines, not rules. So unfortunately, when usage drifts from guidelines, the language itself changes. And sometimes leaves fossilised grammarians irritated.
That’s exactly what happened with Latin. High Latin died as a language, while vulgar Latin evolved into modern Italian. And modern technical, legal and academic language in Italy is built on a predominantly modern Latin foundation.
English is even stranger, being build from old Saxony, Old Norman and Latin. So to say there’s a correct English independent of what is ‘widespread usage’ is a strange and incorrect thing to say.
I take issue with the comment under Rule 2 regarding apostrophes that “Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” It is preferred in some countries; it most certainly is not in others, particularly in the UK. In general, it is preferred only if the name in question is a single syllable, so Jones and Straus would take an “s,” but Texas and Hastings would not. It’s a simple matter of pronunciation; Hay-sting-ses is a more awkward pronunciation than Hay-stings. As for Sanchez, that shouldn’t even be in the list, as it’s a “z” sound, not an “s.”
As stated on the Home page of our website, “This site and The Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation represent American English rules.” Our rule follows Chicago Manual of Style’s rule (7.21) which states, “Some writers and publishers prefer the system, formerly more common, of simply omitting the possessive s on all words ending in s—hence “Dylan Thomas’ poetry,” “Etta James’ singing,” and “that business’ main concern.” Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago.” This rule extends to include names and words ending in x or z.
My name is Rupesh. So, when I have to mention m possession, lets say a pen, how do I write that? Should that be Rupesh’s pen or Rupesh’ pen? And how will I pronounce Rupesh’s? Is an added S sound necessary?
If you are writing about yourself, you would write “my pen.” Our post Apostrophes says, “To show possession by one person, use an apostrophe and add an s.” Therefore, another person would write “Rupesh’s pen” and would pronounce the s.
The z at the end of Sanchez is indeed pronounced like an s. “SAHN-chess” would be the correct pronunciation. This is one of the prominent mistakes that English speakers make while speaking Spanish.
If we are discussing pronunciations though, shouldn’t we also take into account that the possessive s is most often pronounced as a z? If we base what grammatical approach we are going to take on how a word is pronounced, and further base it on the mainstream pronunciations, should this not be referred to as well?
From The Chicago Manual of Style: “The general rule extends to proper nouns, including names ending in s, x, or z, in both their singular and plural forms, as well as letters and numbers.” Therefore, it is not dependent on whether the end of the name is pronounced with an s, x, or z sound.
As a Mexican, Sanchez is MOST definitely a ‘Z’ sound and not an ‘S’. It does not rhyme with ‘chess’, but does rhyme with the first syllable in the bird ‘pheasant’, i.e. ‘fez’.
There seem to be different opinions on this topic. You might be interested in reading this discussion. Half of the discussion is in Spanish.
https://forum.wordreference.com/threads/pronunciation-desde.1495959/
I have a very good example of why one should always (with a few exceptions) say Charlsez whether it is written Charles’ or Charles’s.
A man walks into my office and says “Where’s Charles Desk?” (what he actually wants to know is where Charles’ or Charles’s desk is). The reply comes back “Who’s Charles Desk?” to which the person searching for Charles’s (or Charles’) desk says “No, I am looking for Charles Desk” He is saying Charles rather than Charlesez. That gives one the impression he is talking about a person whose name is Charles Desk, rather than the desk of Charles. So whether you write Charles’ or Charles’s the S after the apostrophe is always said, even when it isn’t written. One can not see a possessive apostrophe in the spoken word, which can lead to a lot of confusion if the second S isn’t spoken. The rule is always (with a few exceptions) say the possessive S, whether it is written or not. Anyway, back to the story. The answer comes back “There is no Charles Desk at XYZ Corporation” and the reply to that is “No, no, I am looking for the desk of Charles” to which the reply comes ” You didn’t ask me for Charles’ (Charles’s) desk. You ask me for Charles Desk. One is a person who doesn’t exist and the other is a a desk that Charles sits at. AKA Charles’s (Charles’) desk.” The person looking for Charles’s desk just gives a blank stare.
So that is why you always (with a very few exceptions) always say the possessive S whether it is written or not. That is the actual rule and people seem to have forgotten it. You don’t have to write the possessive S, but you always have to say it (unless it’s a plural like Childrens, Jonses, or similar). Thank you, Charles.
Jason, you tout your opinion about language as if it is grounded in some sort of universal truth. To claim that Scot’s adherence to formal language is “strange and incorrect” must mean that you have not been exposed to much formal education, since strict adherence to formal English is taught in virtually any high school or college class. Calling it “strange” is just silly.
Or perhaps you are simply a linguistic hypocrite, using the very words you write to convey a message expecting the reader(s) to understand the message, while saying that the meanings of words are relative. Afterall, that is what you are proposing – linguistic realativism. If language does not have “rules” as you say, then language becomes meaningless.
Although it is certainly acceptable for a group of people to develop their own nuances within a language, that does not render the generally accepted, formal langauge “incorrect”.
He is saying language is dynamic with the culture that uses it. Language has rules, but those rules changes over time as people start to break them. This doesn’t render language meaningless, it instead gives birth to new language. So hes right, language IS relative to a population’s understanding of its’ meaning. After all, words and grammar are completely arbitrary with out humans giving them meaning and context. If a group decides the word ‘Apple’ no longer means the red/green fruit grown from trees, then the meaning changes. If this weren’t the case, languages like English and Spanish wouldn’t even exist in the first place. And please, there is no need for the condescending “must mean that you have not been exposed to much formal education” comments. It reflects more poorly on you than any one.
However, we cannot simply “go with the flow”. One problem with that is deciding which flow to go with. Everyone needs to agree on the changes. Another problem is the ability to distinguish between Smith’s and Smiths’, between it’s and its, is lost. This fossil would rather make the distinction clear with the placement of the ‘ rather than take several words to explain whether he means singular or plural, plural or possessive.
He should have written “. . . more than one member of the Jones family . . .”
For clarity and ease of understanding, we have inserted the word one into Scot’s sentence.
How would you make a plural possessive with a word that ends in s then?
That’s a good point, Alex. However, since Scot posted this comment over twelve years ago, we don’t expect that he’ll respond, even though we’d love to see it.
I have come across one very reasonable exception to the rule for single possessive nouns. That exception states that only an apostrophe should be added to form the possessive of ancient names already ending in the “s” sound to which the addition of another “s” sound would produce a very awkward pronunciation.
For example:
Aristophanes’ play
Pericles’ speech
Moses’ staff
Should this exception be widely accepted, or is there another solution for ancient names like these?
It would be more common in American English to say, “We will meet at 7 at the supermarket’s parking lot.”
Yes, that’s one of Will Strunk’s original three exceptions in the Elements of Style. I teach a 4th exception for modern day speakers who have difficulty pronouncing the syllable after the apostrophe in possessives of singulars that end in a ‘z’ sound.
We agree; that’s an allowable practice. The third rule of our article Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z states “To show singular possession of a name ending in s or z, some writers add just an apostrophe. Others also add another s.”
You are right about this exception, Chris. You could include Jesus in this list: Jesus’ teachings
Please see my Rule 1C of Apostrophes, which includes: “One method, common in newspapers and magazines, is to add an apostrophe + s (‘s) to common nouns ending in s, but only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s.
One question — is this a hard and fast rule? That is, is either correct?
Jesus’ beard
Jesus’s beard
There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing nouns that end in s. There is no hard and fast rule; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent. Either of your options is correct. The upcoming eleventh edition of The Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation will include this information.
Ok, so I get that it is grammatically correct to leave a ‘ AFTER an s in certain phrases. But why? I mean, what if I had a last name like Sussis, or Sessisses? People probably have a name like that, and what do you say then? Saying “I’m going to the Sussis’ house.” sounds like Sussisses! That’s a major mouthful, don’t you think? It’s just an opinion, but I’ve always wondered about that.
It is both correct to use ‘Mrs Jones’ house’ or ‘Mrs Jones’s house’. In different countries, one is more commonly used than the other. For example, in the UK it is more common usage as ‘Mrs Jones’s house’, in Australia it is ‘Mrs Jones’ house’ but either is sometimes used and neither is incorrect.
When there is a strong s sound to the end of a name, such as Sussis, adding the apostrophe without another s is a simpler and clearer way to go, e.g. ‘The Sussis’ house.’ Writing, ‘The Sussis’s house’ would not be incorrect, just somewhat clumsy, especially for speech. The important thing is the apostrophe to show possessive and whether or not to add another s is one of the few times you can make a choice about the rules of grammar.
Quick question. Who is Mrs. Jones House? That’s what people hear if you don’t say the possessive S. Whether you write Mrs. Jones’ house or Mrs. Jones’s house it should always be spoken as Jonsez. Not doing so leads to confusion. The listener doesn’t know if you are talking about a person Mrs. Jones House, or a house Mrs. Jones’s (or Jones’s, but always said Jonsez) house. You can write it either way, but always say the possessive S. Not to do so completely changes the meaning of what is being said.
Thanks.
Hannah, you’re correct that you can write “Mrs. Jones’ house” or “Mrs. Jones’s house.”
I prefer keeping it simple by suggesting adding the apostrophe and the “s” to all singular possessive names, regardless of the letter they end in.
I’m confused over how to write the word goddess with apostrophes…
e.g. “the goddess’ blue gown”
or “the goddesses’ blue gown”
or “the goddess’s blue gown”
which one would be right?
Assuming you are writing about one goddess, goddess’s and goddess’ are both acceptable.
I teach my students in India the use of the apostrophe for possession by telling them to write down the name of the ‘possessor’, whether singular or plural, then add the apostrophe, and finally add an ‘s’ if the sound requires it. I find that this way they do not get confused about, for example, “children’s, princess’s, the Joneses’….”
Helen, I agree and also teach this method in the Apostrophe Rules section on my web site, https://www.grammarbook.com.
I would like to know which one is correct:
1. ABB (name of the company) applications and files
2. ABB’s applications and files
Thank you!
Either one could be grammatically correct, depending on how the term is used in a sentence.
Do i need to put an ‘ on the title Extras and if so where?
In context, I am writing a website for a friend and there’s a heading of Extra’s to include a list of other things such as gift vouchers, special offers & similar things.
Many thanks
If the title Extras is for a list of extra things, the word is a simple plural, and no apostrophe is needed.
My question is wedding related. I’m working on RSVP envelopes and they’d like to use i.e. “The Smith’s” , not using the word House afterwards. Is that gramatically correct? They do not want the word “House” used after the last name.
“The Smith’s” would never be correct because “The Smiths” should be plural.
I need more of the context to help you decide between “The Smiths’ ” and “The Smiths.” If house is implied, you can use “The Smiths’.” Example: There will be a reception at The Smiths’ at 2:00 p.m.
the trees’ leaves turned orange
is it correct where the apostophes?
The apostrophe is correct; however, you are missing capitalization and ending punctuation.
The trees’ leaves turned orange.
Which is correct–Kirkland and Ellis’ or …and Ellis’s? It’s a law firm.
Kirkland and Ellis’s
If I had to label a photo of 3 of my friends who are named “Chris”.. would this be labelled “My three favourite Chris’s…” or “My three favourite Chris’…” or how should I label this?!
I know usually if it was a singular Chris, we’d use Chris’ ball or Chris’ pencil case, but I’m really confused with the fact there are multiple people with the name Chris!!
Thanks.
With plurals of names, you don’t need apostrophes.
“My three favorite Chrises”
Which is correct:
Bob and Joe’s fight
or
Bob’s and Joe’s fight
Bob and Joe’s fight
Since they “co-own” the fight, you need an apostrophe only before the second name.
Which use of the word “chapter” is correct in the following sentence:
I have thirty-one (chapters/chapter’s) in my book.
Thank you.
chapters
This is a plural usage, not a possessive usage.
I have another example that comes up at work frequently. Either I’m consistently getting it wrong, or others are. I work at “Something” Industries. When referring to our facilities, people have written:
Something Industries facilities
Something Industrie’s facilities
I have always corrected them with:
Something Industries’ facilities
Please tell me if I am right or wrong. I may be wrong, but if I am, I am not clear on the reasoning. I know you must add the apostrophe to show possession; however, since the word ends in an “s” and “Industries’s” sounds absurd, the only logical solution seems to be the one I suggested.
Elizabeth, you’re right; they’re wrong. Doesn’t it feel good to be validated?
For proof, show them Rule 4 of this page: https://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/apostro.asp
I am giving a door knocker as a gift to a recently married couple… their name is Theos. What is the proper use of plural/possessive? I would think their name would be plural because there are two of them and possessive as it is their house… however I’m struggling with the ending in s?!? And I think a door knoker that reads “The Theoses'” is a bit buch and to me appears to change their last name… Please HELP! Thank you!!!
“The Theoses” is correct. If you don’t like the looks of this, you could use “The Theos Family.” No apostrophe is used because it is not a possessive unless you write “The Theoses’ House.” I hope this helps.
My son has an “ancient” name: Atticus. Should his possession be Atticus’s or Atticus’ (see above comment: Jane 2/4)?
Either is correct. However, I would use Atticus’s for the possessive because you are not referring to the ancient Atticus.
Is Mrs. Evans’s classroom correct?
How about Welcome to the Evans’ home?
or is it Welcome to the Evanses’ home?
How about we’re going to the Evans’ (implying home) or is it…we’re going to the Evanses’?
Thanks!
Would it be wrong to write Mrs. Evans’ classroom? Every grammar book I have including MLA materials has contradictory explanations! So frustrating!
It is better to write Evans’s to let people know that the original name was Evans. This is not mandatory, however.
I think the following example comes down to sounding it out:
Possessive of “Smith and Williams” (law firm)?
I know that it could either be Williams’s or Williams’. From what you’ve written and what’s been said in the comments, however, the latter is incorrect as it’s not an ancient name. I think this is a rare exception to this rule. This name when possessive and sounded out is NOT the same as “Kirkland and Ellis’s.”
Do you agree that “Smith and Williams'” is correct? And is there a rule succinctly explaining why?
I agree that Smith and Williams’ is considered acceptable. However, because the name ends in an “s,” one could assume that Williams’ means that the name was William, not Williams. To avoid confusion, I recommend using the apostrophe “s” on all names ending in “s.” I don’t hear any difference between Ellis’s and Williams’s.
See https://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/apostro.asp
Then what about plurals that don’t end with the letter “S”? If a singular like “Gus” requires another “S” after the apostrophe, then plurals like “men” “fungi” just require an apostrophe. e.g., “the Men’ room”, “the fungi’ characteristics”.
Rule 4 of Apostrophes is “To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.” The third example under this rule using the word children demonstrates how to form the plural possessive of an irregular noun that has a plural form that does not involve adding an s. In this case, the plural of the singular noun child is children. Then use the apostrophe and add an s to form children’s. Thus, the Men’s room, the fungi’s characteristics.
This is interesting. We are doing our Christmas card and i would have put “Merry Christmas, From The Williams’ ” not the Williamses. Williamses is correct, correct? So, if it would have said, ” you are invited to the Williams’ house” that would have been the proper usage of Williams’ correct?
“Merry Christmas from the Williamses” and “You are invited to the Williamses’ house” are correct.
My name is Chris, and this has always confused me. I have always wondered if to show possession of something that’s mine (or possession for any proper name), do I put “apostrophe s” after my name or not? In other words, if I’m talking about my boat, would I write “Chris’ boat” or “Chris’s boat”?
What about other proper names, such as Texas. If you wanted to say you had the most active car club in Texas, would you say “Texas’ most active car club” or “Texas’s most active car club”?
My friend who is a teacher says that if the proper name ends in an S, it is inappropriate to put apostrophe S after the name. Is it a hard written rule, such as what constitutes a sentence, or is a rule that is commonly accepted? (I like definitives) =) Thanks!
Our Rule 1c of Apostrophes on our website addresses your problem:
Rule 1c Some writers and editors add only an apostrophe to all nouns ending in s. And some add an apostrophe + s to every proper noun, be it Hastings’s or Jones’s.
One method, common in newspapers and magazines, is to add an apostrophe + s (‘s) to common nouns ending in s, but only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s.
Examples:
the class’s hours
Mr. Jones’ golf clubs
the canvas’s size
Texas’ weather
Care must be taken to place the apostrophe outside the word in question. For instance, if talking about a pen belonging to Mr. Hastings, many people would wrongly write Mr. Hasting’s pen (his name is not Mr. Hasting).
Correct: Mr. Hastings’ pen
Another widely used technique is to write the word as we would speak it. For example, since most people saying, “Mr. Hastings’ pen” would not pronounce an added s, we would write Mr. Hastings’ pen with no added s. But most people would pronounce an added s in “Jones’s,” so we’d write it as we say it: Mr. Jones’s golf clubs. This method explains the punctuation of for goodness’ sake.
I’m so glad I found this post and this website! I am getting a
married in January and will be taking on my husband’s last name. I am a stickler for good grammar so I need to know how to use
my new name. I read the whole post and all the comments, but I still just want to double check that I’m right. My new last name will be Myers. Will the plural be Myerses? And the possessive plural is Myerses’ ? And singular plural is Myers’s?
I’m only double checking because it seemed like some things I read were differentiating between names ending in an “s” sound and a “z” sound.
Thank you so much.
You are correct on all counts, Jasmine. Good job!
What about a company name… Waves?
Waves’ television programs
Waves’s television programs
I think the first one seems better, but which would use the best grammar?
Thank you!
If you write “Wave’s television programs,” you are implying that the name is “Wave” rather than “Waves.” Follow the same rule that you would for forming the possessive of common nouns ending in “s.” Therefore, “Waves’s television programs” is correct.
My question concerns acronyms that end in “s.” I work for a Board of Cooperative Educational Services (BOCES, pronounced BO-seas) and I write technical bids for our schools. I am currently writing one on behalf of two BOCES and am concerned about the proper use of the apostrophe in plural form here. To say “Orange and Sullivan BOCES’s networks” is very clumsy, especially since no one pronounces it that way, regardless of possesion.
So, which is correct; BOCES’, BOCES’s, or BOCESes’.
Thank you!
Bob, this is tricky because the plural of Board of Cooperative Educational Services is actually Boards of Cooperative Educational Services. Therefore, it would be better if you could write “Orange and Sullivan Boards’ networks.” The other tricky aspect is that BOCES is really being used as an adjective here rather than as a possessive noun. Therefore, you could also write, “Orange and Sullivan BOCES networks.” Either of these two choices would be much better than any of the options you intuitively dislike.
If i have a sentance that reads “At least annually, the partners review the firms human resources policies….) Would firms be as it is, or would it be firm’s, or firms’. Probably easy for most, but very confusing to me.
Thanks.
“At least annually, the partners review the firm’s human resources policies.” Firm is singular possessive in this sentence.
Oh, thank you so much, I really appreciate the quick reply.
I’ve decided to name my son Brooks but I’m still having a hard time figuring out what is correct.
Brooks’ looks right to me.
Brookses just looks very odd and wasn’t how I was taught..
Brookses’ still doesn’t feel right.
Then there’s Brooks’s….
With the examples in previous comments, there are a couple options and seems like all are correct but example 1 is the only one that feels right to me.
Any suggestions?
Help! :)
Brooks looks right to/at me.
Brooks looks very odd.
Brooks still doesn’t feel right.
Then there’s Brooks…
Don’t use apostrophes for your son’s name or it will seem as though the name is Brook, not Brooks.
I named my son Brooks too. I always use Brooks’s but most everyone else writes Brooks’ so I have no idea which is the correct way. Help!
As I mention in my Rule 2 of the Apostrophes section, using the apostrophe and another s to show singular possession of a name ending in s is preferred. I am more in agreement with The Chicago Manual of Style, which states this as a rule over The AP Stylebook, which prefers adding only the apostrophe.
I too am getting married. My new name will be Ables. So pleural will be Ableses? Singular possessive will be Ables’s and pleural possessive Ableses’?
Thanks
Plural of Ables is Ableses. Singular possessive is Ables’s. Plural possessive is Ableses’. Note: “pleural” should be “plural.”
Examples: Mrs. Ables’s dog, The Ableses’ house, I went to the Ableses for dinner last night.
Congratulations on your marriage!
Shouldn’t it be “I went to the Ableses’ for dinner last night”? The word “house” is exluded but implied.
That could also be an acceptable option. It would be preferable to rewrite the sentence to remove any doubt: “I went to the Ableses’ house for dinner last night” or “I joined the Ableses for dinner at their home last night.”
I’d love to know the plural of ‘haus’. I realise this is not an english word, but i’m using it as a product name. would the plural be haus’ ? or hauses?
I’ve written it as haus’ for months [with the apostrophe after the s, simply because it looks better] and then someone else wrote it as hauses.
So confusing! I’d love to know which is correct or if, in fact, both are acceptable.
Thank you in advance.
In English, the plural of a word ending in an “s” is formed by adding “es,” and the apostrophe would indicate a possessive, not a plural. However, the word “haus” is German. The plural is “hauser.”
haus is German. The plural is “hauser”
Thank you for the information. We have revised our earlier response.
My friend’s last name is Jones. When i write about his house where “Jones” would mean the entire family, which one is correct?
The Jones’ House or The Joneses’ House.
I am a bit confused because i have seen both these forms used a lot and not sure whether both are accepted as correct.
the Joneses’ house
From GrammarBook.com Apostrophes Rule 4
To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.
Examples:
two boys’ hats
two women’s hats
two actresses’ hats
two children’s hats
the Changs’ house
the Joneses’ golf clubs
Where would the apostrophe go in this instance? — Invest in Kids board chair
Invest in Kids is the name of an organization. I think it should be Invest in Kids’ but I keep going back and forth! Any help would be appreicated
If you are referring to the chairperson of the board, write it this way: Invest in Kids board chair.
What is the correct punctuation for a yearbook heading that says:
“Grade Tens”.
Why not call it Grade Ten? If you are going to pluralize Ten, then don’t use an apostrophe.
if it was not like copy print and was like a game type you guys know what i mean like a quiz it would have been better.
Thank you for your suggestion. There is an additional free quiz on apostrophes here:
https://www.grammarbook.com/grammar_quiz/apostrophes_1.asp.
The subscription quiz area contains several more.
What is the singular possessive of the following words? Please help me.
Eskimo, clothes, and scissors.
What is the Plural for of the words: salmon and louse.
Also what is the plural possessive of the words: Pliers, passerby, hero, louse, and ox.
I have been trying to figure out these words for about a week, so please help me.
Singular possessives:
eskimo’s
Clothes and scissors have no singular form. This type of word is called a “plurale tantum,” which is Latin for “plural only.” Thus the possessive forms would be clothes’ and scissors’.
Plurals:
salmon
lice
Plural Possessive:
pliers’
passersby’s
heroes’
lice’s
oxen’s
My wife and I had quite a discussion about this. I was utterly convinced that anytime a word ends in “s”, the possessive should have an apostrophe, sans the extra “-s”.
From the discussion, I can see it rightly, now…
If I were talking about something belonging to multiple persons named “William”:
EX – It’s a funny thing, most Williams’ personalities are very similar.
[there is NO extra “-s” in the possessive because the singular is William, which is plural in the sentence]
But, if I were talking about something belonging to a single person with the name Williams:
EX – Mr. Williams’s flowers are the best in the neighborhood.
[there is an extra “-s” in the possessive because the singular is Williams, which is NOT plural in the sentence]
And, if I were talking about a group of persons with the name Williams:
EX – Those Williamses are a very caring bunch; we should invite them over.
[the plural of Williams adds an “-es” to the end]
Lastly, if I were talking about something belonging to a group of persons with the name Williams:
EX – The Williamses’ two dogs are so spoiled, they have their own personal masseur and masseuse.
[there is NO extra “-s” in the possessive because the singular is Williams, which is plural in the sentence]
Alas, I will have to concede that my wife was more correct than I. Though, I do so without chagrin.
Thanks to everyone for clarifying!
Yes, you’ve got it!
So, Ross (as in a family) would be:
Plural: Rosses
Plural Possessive: Rosses’
But for one of the family, it would be Ross’s?
Yes, you are correct.
I was surprised to read in the March 2011 Newsweek magazine several words ending in s had the ‘s ending. One word was on the cover and I thought that someone had made a major mistake. I can’t remember ever seeing or reading that to be correct. I am graduated nearly 47 years ago and have never known that to be correct spelling. That is why I am now on this site checking the rules. Is this a “new” rule as in the past decade or so? I work in an office and over the years have read a great many reports but never s’s used. I can’t wait until next week’s staff meeting.
Since you did not give any specific examples, I cannot comment on the words that you thought were misspelled. If the word ended in an s and it was a singular possessive, then the ‘s would be correct. I do not believe this to be a new rule.
I think this is a new rule in the past decade. I went to elementary school 1997-2003 (in America, so this only applies for sure to American English), and I was taught NEVER to put an “s” after the apostrophe when making a single noun that ends in “s” possessive.
However, I just did some research, and it seems like “‘s” after any singular noun no matter the ending is now the encouraged rule. I’m glad it’s simplified!
I am having shirts made for my husband & myself. They are going to say Lucus’ Mom & Lucus’ Dad. Is This correct? Should it be Lucus’s instead?
It should say “Lucus’s Mom & Lucus’s Dad.”
The kids name is Santos. Should the shirt say:
Santos’ mom or Santos’s mom? Please help!
The rule in our Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z blog (consistent with The Chicago Manual of Style) states, “To show singular possession of a name ending in s, ch, or z, use the apostrophe and another s.” Therefore, write Santos’s mom.
Could someone give me some guidance for my wedding invites? My invite designer wrote “Sarah and Chris’ wedding” on our response cards. Is this correct beacuse together we are plural? My grammar instincts are telling me it should be Sarah and Chris’s. Maybe I should just change it to Chris and Sarah’s :). Thank you in advance for any advice!
If two people possess the same item, an apostrophe and s is used. Since the wedding belongs to both of you, you are correct. It should read “Sarah and Chris’s wedding.”
What would be the correct grammar if I were referring to a menu item at T.G.I. Friday’s. Would I write T.G.I. Friday’s’ chicken tenders or T.G.I. Fridays’s chicken tenders or something completely different? Thank you.
T.G.I. Friday’s chicken tenders should be fine, especially for informal writing. Some may argue that T.G.I. Friday’s’s chicken tenders should be technically correct but it certainly looks odd. The safest route would be to rearrange the phrase as The chicken tenders at T.G.I. Friday’s.
Many thanks for the help and answers – this site is great.
Here’s my sentence (and my predicament):
“Please provide the vehicle identification numbers of the department’s Trans Ams and LeMans.”
Would Trans Am get an apostrophe? Trans Am’s
What about LeMans (which is the vehicle name)? I think LeMans’.
Thank you!
Please provide the vehicle identification numbers of the department’s Trans Ams and LeManses. Since the cars are simple plurals, not possessives, there is no need for apostrophes.
I was writing an essay on a test and ended up in a weird apostrophe situation.
What do I do here:
The dog colored the woman(‘s?), Mary(‘s?), carpet a deep yellow.
My first inclination was to put the apostrophe s on Mary, thats how we say it, but then I tried to read the sentence without “Mary’s” in it and it didn’t make sense. Woman’s, Mary’s seems awkward, and woman’s, Mary seems off too.
Later, I tried to look at the apostrophe s problem from a different perspective altogether and found a similar problem:
The dog(‘s?), Fido(‘s), running quickly, hoping to escape.
Here I was trying to use the apostrophe s as a contraction for “dog is.” I know that if it we weren’t using the contraction it would be “The dog, Fido, is running quickly, hoping to escape.” but, I don’t see how to make the transition.
Oh! Also, in this sentence what is the grammatical term for “Mary” and “Fido”? A clarifying clause?
Thanks in advance for the help.
In general, essay tests call for a formal writing style. Your sentences could easily be reworded as:
The dog colored Mary’s carpet a deep yellow. (Leave out the woman’s; it’s unnecessary.)
The dog Fido is running quickly, hoping to escape.
or
Fido’s running quickly, hoping to escape.
In these cases, Mary’s is an adjective and in the second sentence Fido is the subject.
I have a problem one teacher is saying the name should be
Davis’s class the other is Lutins’ Class should they be different in the same publication? Both names are plural and I think they are both right!
the names are Davis and Lutins. Please help this is for the yearbook!
You say that the names are Davis and Lutins, however, you say the names are plural. Plural means more than one. Are you saying that there are two or more persons with the same name? I am guessing not, so “Davis’s class” and “Lutins’s class” would be the correct usage.
Could the word Thanks ever be used as plural possessive such as Thanks’?
I cannot think of any case where thanks would be a plural possessive.
I am monogramming something for a family last name is Anderson. Would it be The Anderson’s or The Andersons?
The monogram should read “The Andersons.”
My daughter is getting married and is working on her invitations and address labels. Her last name will be Tannis. According to all of your examples and explanations….are the following correct for each circumstance? (I’m a little surprised at some of the examples above…I taught elementary school for 29 years and taught the rule that if the word already ended in an s…just add the apostrophe.)
singular- Tannis – My last name is Tannis.
singular possessive- Tannis’s – Joe Tannis’s shoes are black.
plural- Tannises- The Tannises are coming to our house.
plural possessive: Tannises’- The Tannises’ dogs are mean.
How would an address label read? The Tannises ? The Tannis’ (implying house)
You are correct:
Singular is Tannis
Singular possessive is Tannis’s
Plural is Tannises
Plural possessive is Tannises’
The address label could read “The Tannises” or “The Tannis Family.”
Regarding the practice of just adding an appostrophe to a word already ending in s, “Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago Manual of Style.”
I work in the office of preschool, and Nicholas has become a very popular student name. A teacher requested that I make a label “Nicholas’ Treasured Memories” after I had given her “Nicholas’s Treasured Memories.” Although I was frustrated by the request, I gave in. Should I have stuck to my grammar or was she correct in requesting the change? Thank you!
You certainly were placed in a difficult position. Some writers and publishers prefer the system of omitting the possessive ‘s on all words and names ending in s, however, such usage does disregard the pronunciation of the word or name as well as the practice recommended by most authoritative sources including The Chicago Manual of Style. Maybe you could gently direct the teacher’s attention to my website and to the Note in Rule 2 in Apostrophes which says:
NOTE: Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.
I have often seen words such as Missions Reception used as
Mission’s Reception, Missions’ Reception and Missions Reception.
Which is correct. This is for a missions banquet.
Pastors’ book club, or can I say Pastors book club, without the ‘ as the end?
Use of an apostrophe indicates possession. The ‘s or s’ would indicate ownership of the reception or book club by either one (‘s) or more than one (s’) mission or pastor, respectively. Using the reasoning presented in the blog entitled “Confusing Possessives,” your guess is as good as anyone’s as to whether an apostrophe should be used or not, especially with Missions Reception. In the case of the book club, if it clearly refers to a club at one church with one pastor, I would opt for “Pastor’s book club” or even more specifically, “Pastor John’s book club.”
I’m getting married in September and I’m putting together a guestbook. My new last name will be Balderrama. On the spine I’d like to write “The Balderramas” Is that correct? My fiancé insists it should be “The Balderrama’s” I know it’s his last name, but I’m thinking I’m in the right here.
Yes, you are correct unless you were to write “The Balderramas’ Guest Book.” Then you would need an appostrophe to indicate possession. If you are just meaning this book is for or about more than one person named Balderrama, it would be “The Balderramas.”
I am a teacher….and my last name is Gass so would i say “Miss Gass’s Classroom” or is it correct to say “Miss Gass’ Classroom” ?
According to the note under Rule 2, “Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” Therefore, “Miss Gass’s classroom” would be the preferred spelling.
If i am trying to say Mikes children yell, would i put Mike’s or Mikes children yell.
You would use an appostrophe before the s to show possession (belonging to Mike).
Mike’s children yell.
This is a much debated rule amongst family and friends. Glad for this to be cleared up. It’s also nice to see even professional grammarians make mistakes, (Quiz Question 8: “…get up at down”) or would that be in the vocabulists’ or lexicographers’ realm?
Yes, even grammarians are guilty of typographical errors. Thanks for pointing it out. The error is now fixed!
I am writing out thank you cards for my daughter and I want to use the word princess instead of daughter. I am not sure if I should add an ‘s or just the ‘
ex: Thank you for joining us in celebrating our princess’s 1st birthday
thank you in advanced
To show singular possession for a word ending in an s or s sound, use the apostrophe and another s.
“Thank you for joining us in celebrating our princess’s first birthday.”
how about writing -‘s worlds biggest..-. I’m unable to find rules how to apply apostrophes in front of a noun
Rule 2 in the “Apostrophes” section says, “Use the apostrophe to show possession. Place the apostrophe before the s to show singular possession.”
Since “world’s biggest” is singular possessive, you need to use ‘s regardless of which noun follows it.
I am having a picture frame engraved for a wedding gift. They are asking for the plural of their last name. Their last name is Arps. Would the plural be “The Arpses”? There will be nothing written but “The Arpses”.
Since you are meaning that the frame is for more than one person named Arps, it would be “The Arpses.”
Do you know when the single possessive on nouns ending in ‘s’ changed from ‘s to s’s? I know that in the Chicago Style Manual the change was accepted in the 15th edition (2003) and finalized in the 16th edition (2010). Turabian had the change in the 2007 7th edition (and I believe in the 6th as well).The Gregg Reference Manual shows this change as finalized (no other method may be used) in 2003.
So, when did it begin?
We may not be able to pinpoint exactly when this shift began. The rules for using apostrophes are continuously evolving. Each style manual seems to have different rules and some still do not recommend this change. For example, AP Stylebook says, “Singular proper names ending in s: Use only an apostrophe.” Since there is disagreement between the different style guides, this is probably one of the more flexible “rules.” In my opinion, Chicago Manual of Style has the best explanation in commenting on using only an apostrophe: “Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago Manual of Style.”
What about showing possession when referring to a song written by The Beatles?
I know that one may write “Grieg’s Nocture in C” or “Schumann’s Traumerei” but would it be correct to write “The Beatles’s Eleanor Rigby”? Or “The Beatles’ Eleanor Rigby”?
Thanks!
Since “The Beatles” is already plural, you would just need to add the apostrophe, therefore, “The Beatles’ Eleanor Rigby” is correct.
I am at odds with some over the proper use of an apostrophe in this instance. I have designed a brochure and I believe it should read:
Heritage Baptist Church Presents Our 9th One Day Ladies Seminar
someone else believes it should read
Heritage Baptist Church Presents Our 9th One Day Ladies’ Seminar
I think the apostrophe makes it appear that the Ladies own the seminar, while my version has “ladies” being the adjective. What do you think?
It appears that either one would be acceptable. For example, there is the Ladies Professional Golf Association but note the apostrophe in Ladies’ Home Journal. AP Stylebook says, “Do not add an apostrophe to a word ending in s when it is used primarily in a descriptive sense: citizens band radio, a Cincinnati Reds infielder, a teachers college, a Teamsters request, a writers guide.”
On the other hand, Chicago Manual of Style says, “The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively–to modify another noun–is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Although terms such as employees’ cafeteria sometimes appear without an apostrophe, Chicago dispenses with the apostrophe only in proper names (often corporate names) that do not use one or where there is clearly no possessive meaning:
children’s rights, farmers’ market, women’s soccer team, boys’ clubs, taxpayers’ associations (or taxpayer associations), consumers’ group (or consumer group), but Publishers Weekly, Diners Club.”
You could argue that “ladies” is a descripitive word, or that it is a seminar for ladies, therefore providing a case for either one. Also, since one-day is a phrasal adjective (compound modifier) describing the seminar, I would recommend use of a hyphen.
What about a noun ending in s, with the same singular and plural form.
For example the flower, Cosmos. I think the singular and plural are the same.
Singular: This Cosmos’s petals are brightly colored.
Plural: Cosmos’ petals are usually brightly colored.
Thanks!
The singular is cosmos and the plural can be either cosmos or cosmoses.
According to Rule 1 in this “Apostrophes with Words Ending in s” blog, “To show singular possession for a word ending in an s or s sound, use the apostrophe and another s.” Therefore, the singular possessive would be cosmos’s.
To show plural possession of a word ending in an s or s sound, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe. The correct plural possessive would be cosmos’ or cosmoses’.
Thus, you were right!
Which is correct:
it has its moments
it has it’s moments
my train of logic says it’s. not as in it is, but to show ownership of the moments. thanks in advace
For this special word, it’s means it is or it has, and ownership or possession is expressed by its without the apostrophe. Therefore, “it has its moments.”
I don’t understand why people use apostrophe s for pluralizing. Even when I type “thank yous” as a plural spell-check wants it to be “thank-you’s”. I see this a lot and don’t know if it is wrong or fine. Examples: CD’s, numbers such as 4’s, etc. There are no letters missing and it’s not possessive.
You are correct: this is a very common error. As Rule 11 in our “Apostrophes” section of the Blue Book and website states, “The plurals for capital letters and numbers used as nouns are not formed with apostrophes.” The exception is when the meaning would be unclear otherwise such as with A’s or 0’s (you don’t mean the words As or Os). Similarly, there would be no confusion leaving out the apostrophe with thank you. In more formal writing you could avoid this problem by writing out thank-you cards or thank-you notes.
This one keeps coming up at work and we cannot figure out which to use:
He is a patient of Dr. Smith or He is a patient of Dr. Smith’s ?
I have found where they say you should rearrange the sentence so it is not an “of” sentence, but if we were to leave it as is, which would be the correct?
Thanks!
You are correct that it is best to limit the number of prepositional phrases, so the best choice would be Dr Smith’s patient. If you leave the sentence as is, a patient of Dr. Smith is correct.
How do you write the abbreviation of photograph’s? Is it photos’ or photo’s or photos?
The abbreviation of the plural word photographs is photos.
Example: He takes nice wedding photos.
Since you asked about photgraph’s with an appostrophe (the singular possessive form), the abbreviation of that word is photo’s.
Example: That photo’s corner is bent.
What about when the owner comes at the end of the sentence?
Is it:
The football was Allister’s. The parrot was Nicola’s.
Or
The football was Allisters. The parrot was Nicolas.
“It was decided that the victory – after a particularly long and arduous football match – was Manchester United’s.”
Am I right in using an apostrophe here?
If the owner comes at the end of the sentence you still need the possessive form, which uses an apostrophe.
The football was Allister’s.
The parrot was Nicola’s. (“The parrot was Nicolas” would mean that the name of the parrot was Nicolas!)
It was decided that the victory — after a particularly long and arduous football match — was Manchester United’s.
I think this has always had a flexible rule for words ending in “s”, but students (at least in my university years in the late 80’s to mid-90’s) and grammar books of the time advised to be consistent thoughout one’s work.
I think the leaning back then was NOT to use an s-apostrophe-s (and just go with the lone apostrophe for a singular noun ending in s), where as now, the leaning IS to use the extra s after the apostrophe.
I’ve always loved grammar and when I married a man in 1994 and changed my last name to one that ended in S, I researched it thoroughly so I would know how to handle the situation when it arose.
Back then, I decided to go with:
singular Willis
plural Willises
singular possessive Willis’
plural possessive Willises’
After seeing s’s used in so many publications (and it still makes me cringe)– I thought it was time to review what is accepted– and learned that while the rule is STILL a bit foggy, I would probably now be considered MORE correct if I went with the singular possessive of Willis’s.
I do agree, however, with one of the earliest posters that stated that when enough people start to forget grammar rules, the rules change to accomodate them. (“dumbing down” language)– The perfect example is “ain’t”. I grew up being told by teachers that “Ain’t ain’t a word because it ain’t in the dictionary”– and now, if you pick up a dictionary, you will find that it is!
(I have not looked to see if such words as “lite” for light or “donut” for doughnut have been included yet, but if they haven’t been, it is probably just a matter of time! Who knows what texting will do to our “proper and accepted” rules!)
Yes, the dumbing down, er, I mean the evolution of the English language continues. “Lite” and “donut” are both recognized in the dictionary as variants of “light” and “doughnut.” Some of the texting phrases (such as LOL) are listed, but they are considered abbreviations.
Here you are complaining about the incorrect usage of apostrophes while writing things like 80’s and 90’s.
It should be ’80s and ’90s.
While it is simpler to put an apostrophe before the incomplete numeral and no apostrophe between the number and the s, our Rule 11 of Writing Numbers acknowledges that some writers place an apostrophe after the number (although this practice used to be incorrect).
Question for you: We want to have a sign made that has says:
Evans’s Wine Bar…..
is that the correct way to spell and punctuate?
or is it Evanses’ Wine Bar……
thanks.
The rules in the “Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z” section of our blog state, “To show the plural of a name that ends in s, ch, or z, add es. To show plural possession of a name ending in s, ch, or z, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe.”
The Evanses’ Wine Bar is correct.
I have still some doubts. I learned English in England and I remember being taught that words that end with “s” in possessive situations you just add the apostrophe with no “s”.
Jones’ cat
Holmes’ friend
My brothers’ things (as in two brothers)
I teach American English at a school, and I came across an american version of a Sherlock Holmes novel and I read something like Sherlock Holmes’s and now I am utterly confused! Is there any chance you can help me figure this out!?
The rules for using apostrophes are continuously evolving. In America, each style manual seems to have different rules. Since there is disagreement between the different style guides, this is probably one of the more flexible “rules.” In my opinion, Chicago Manual of Style has the best explanation in commenting on using only an apostrophe: “Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago Manual of Style.” In the case of plural possessives, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe:
Bill Jones’s cat (or, in the case of the Jones family, the Joneses’ cat)
Sherlock Holmes’s friend (or, in the case of the Holmes family, the Holmeses’ friend)
my brothers’ things (two brothers)
Is it Sipylus’s main site or Sipylus’ main site?
Trying to update HTML meta tag with the info.
The first rule in this “Apostrophes with Words Ending in s” blog states, “To show singular possession for a word ending in an s or s sound, use the apostrophe and another s.” Therefore, Sipylus’s main site is correct.
I am doing a gender reveal invitation. It is to find out the gender of baby Fitzsimmons. Do I write it as:
Baby Fitzsimmons’s Gender Reveal
Or
Baby Fitzsimmons Gender Reveal
Since it is a singular possessive (the gender reveal of the baby), “Baby Fitzsimmons’s Gender Reveal” is correct.
How about the name ‘Edwards’?
Mr. Edwards’ Room?
or
Mr. Edwards’s Room?
The note under Rule 2 of our “Apostrophes” section states, “Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” Therefore, “Mr. Edwards’s Room” is preferred.
And are these sentences both correct:
The coach was the pupils’.
The coach was owned by the pupils’.
The first sentence is correct. The second sentence does not need an apostrophe since it is not the possessive form of pupils. While The coach was owned by the pupils is grammatically correct, this is an unusual sentence in that pupils do not normally own a coach, whether a human being or a mode of transportation!
how can we use Apostrophe s with a name like “Elizabeth II”? do we add s to Elizabeth of to II?
Since we would say, “Queen Elizabeth the Second’s coronation was the first to be televised,” it would be written “Queen Elizabeth II’s coronation was the first to be televised.”
Here’s an odd one for you. My name ends in an S. When people using it want to indicate possession, such as saying
“Those are Grates (‘s/s’ ?) shoes, where should the apostrophe be placed, and should there be an extra S or not?
You may follow Rule 2 of the “Apostrophes” section or the rule in our blog “Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z” which says, “To show singular possession of a name ending in s, ch, or z, use the apostrophe and another s.” Therefore, “Those are Grates’s shoes” is correct.
Which is correct: Michael Jones’ house or Michael Jones’s house.
Many thanks.
The note under Rule 2 in the “Appostrophes” section of Grammarbook.com states, ” Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” Therefore, I recommend Michael Jones’s house.
Is it childrens meals – children’s meals – or – childrens’ meals?
Rule 4 in the “Apostrophes” section of Grammarbook.com says, “To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.” Therefore, children’s meals is correct.
Last name Childs — how do I punctuate this…..??
The Childs purchased the Olive street house in 1948, lived in it for two years and then left for duties abroad.
Or is this good…………??
thx……..billy
The plural for the name Childs is the Childses. If the first names are known, it could be “Bob and Betty Childs purchased the Olive Street house in 1948, lived in it for two years, and then left for duties abroad.”
How do we properly say the Ryan Sisters’s CD launch?
Thanks.
Rule 4 in the “Apostrophes” section of Grammarbook.com states,”To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.” The plural of the noun sister is sisters, then use the appostrophe to show possession.
The Ryan Sisters’ CD launch.
For 6 years you have helped everyone who has posted with their questions and concerns here.
I have gone through and read them all; I want to thank you for continuing to help us, years later, and for being so knowledgeable and helpful.
Thank you!
I appreciate your kind comment, Shawn.
Which is correct: “Patrick and Thomas’s return from overseas” or “Patrick and Thomas’ return from overseas”? I want to indicate joint ownership.
Ah, I just read rule #8, and it looks like “Patrick and Thomas’s…” is the correct one to use. Is there any case where “Patrick and Thomas’…” would be correct?
To avoid confusion, I recommend using the apostrophe “s” on all names ending in “s.” Patrick and Thomas’s is the preferred spelling. Not all style manuals may agree.
My last name is Yates. I thought I was suppose to write, “Dr. Yates’s area of expertise is . . . because I am just one person and I am not Jesus or Moses. My collaborators, however, tell me I should be saying, “Dr. Yates’ area of expertise is . . . ” because my name ends in an “s” sound, not a “z” sound. Which is correct? Or can one make a case for either? Thanks in advance for answering a long-standing question which has plagued me, quite literally, all of my life.
Our rule as stated in the blog “Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z” says, “To show singular possession of a name ending in s, ch, or z, use the apostrophe and another s.” However, not all style manuals agree. For example, AP Stylebook says, “Singular proper names ending in s: Use only an apostrophe.” Since there is disagreement between the different style guides, this is probably one of the more flexible “rules.” In my opinion, Chicago Manual of Style has the best explanation in commenting on using only an apostrophe: “Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago Manual of Style.” Therefore, I agree with you in writing, “Dr. Yates’s area of expertise is . . . “
Question: I see people adding “‘s” to abbreviations that are simply being pluralized (like CDs). We just put out a bunch of awards for students getting all As and Bs. Is the way I’ve written that correct, or would you write A’s and B’s? The latter doesn’t make sense to me (since they’re not possessive), but it seems to be the norm.
Thanks!
This is a good question because it represents an exception to one of our rules. Rule 11 in the “Apostrophes” section of our website states, “The plurals for capital letters and numbers used as nouns are not formed with apostrophes.” The exception is when the meaning would be unclear otherwise such as with A’s or I’s (not to be confused with the words As or Is). If you feel that, in your particular context, there would be no confusion with the word As, then you may choose to omit the apostrophe.
The AP Stylebook says this:
“SINGULAR PROPER NAMES ENDING IN S: Use only an apostrophe: Achilles’ heel, Agnes’ book, Ceres’ rites, Descartes’ theories, Dickens’ novels, Euripides’ dramas, Hercules’ labors, Jesus’ life, Jules’ seat, Kansas’ schools, Moses’ law, Socrates’ life, Tennessee Williams’ plays, Xerxes’ armies. (An exception is St. James’s Palace.)”
For me, that’s the last word.
And by the way, there is no differentiation between “ancient” proper names and current proper names. What an odd notion!
This topic has been discussed several times in our blog “Apostrophes with Words Ending in ‘s.'” The different style manuals are not all in agreement. We prefer to follow The Chicago Manual of Style which states, “Some writers and publishers prefer the system, formerly more common, of simply omitting the possessive s on all words ending in s–hence “Dylan Thomas’ poetry,” “Etta James’ singing,” and “that business’ main concern.” Though easy to apply and economical, such usage disregards pronunciation and is therefore not recommended by Chicago.” (7.21)
The discussion you refer to regarding the differentiation between “ancient” proper names and current proper names is from a blog discussion dated February 4, 2007. The Chicago Manual of Style used to differentiate between ancient proper names and current proper names in regard to the possessive form. They no longer recommend making an exception, therefore, Euripides’s tragedies, the Ganges’s source, and Xerxes’s armies are the correct spellings.
I have recently started working in a school and feel very embarrassed that I am now confused after 28 years of working that I don’t know where the apostophes should be.
For e.g.
The teachers will be travelling on the bus with the children. Should that be ‘s s’ or neither?
The childs bag should be left out side.
The students need to be in the hall tomorrow waiting for the teachers.
I’m confused and need to school. All these different ways have put me back years.
Rule 2 in our “Apostrophes” section says, “Use the apostrophe to show possession. Place the apostrophe before the s to show singular possession.” In your first sentence, the word teachers is a simple plural noun, so no apostrophe is needed. The word child’s in the second sentence is a possessive noun (belonging to the child) and needs an apostrophe. Your third sentence does not contain any possessive nouns, just plurals, therefore, no apostrophes are needed. You may find it helpful to review the rules in our “Apostrophes” section on our website, GrammarBook.com.
How would you write the three Smith brothers’ basketballs were lost. Note: the (three) brothers last name is Smith
Would you write: The three Smith brothers’ basketballs were lost.
If the last name was Jones would you write: The three Jones brothers’ basketballs were lost.
You are correct since the names Smith and Jones are serving as adjectives for the plural possessive noun brothers‘. However, if you were talking about basketballs that belonged to an entire family, then it would be:
The Smiths’ basketballs were lost.
The Joneses’ basketballs were lost.
Can I write Unites States’s cities (use of ‘s at the end of the word United States????
The Chicago Manual of Style’s rule (7.19) states, “When the singular form of a noun ending in s is the same as the plural, the possessives of both are formed by the addition of an apostrophe only…
The same rule applies when the name of a place or an organization or a publication (or the last element in the name) is a plural form ending in s, such as the United States, even though the entity is singular.”
United States’ cities OR
United States cities (non-possessive form with United States being an adjective to describe cities; meaning cities located in the United States)
Hey, ok if someone’s name was gorgeous, would the plural form be gorgeouses and singular form be gorgeous’s
Since all names should be capitalized, the singular form would be Gorgeous and the singular possessive would be Gorgeous’s. The plural form, if there were two people with the same name, would be written Gorgeouses.
Please help. In my literacy class today we had an apostrophe placed in a spot I didnt agree with. If the sentence is “The peoples umbrellas blew away” where should the apostrophe go? I think it should go after people – the people own the umbrellas, not the peoples, but most others in the discussion disagreed with me and think it should go after the s.
You are correct. The word people is already plural. To form the possessive, add ‘s.
The people’s umbrellas blew away.
I’m writing a Contract for a company named Best-Painters. So when I mention Best-Painters it’s singular, because it is the name of the company so, could you please tell me if its correct how I apply the apostrophe in the next sentences?
– In general, the user should not realize any action that commits an outrage against Best-Painters’s good functioning.
– You agree not sending e-mails with viruses to the Best-Painters’s community.
– Create an account using the Best-Painters.com’s site.
– Do you want to know more about Best-Painters’s services?
– Regards from the Best-Painters’s Team
I would appreciate your help.
Thank you.
Yes, the rules for singular possession apply here. The NOTE in Rule 2 on singular possession says, “Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” However, in this particular case, perhaps due to the length of the company’s name, the s’s construction sounds a bit clunky to me. So, you have a choice and both would be acceptable; just be consistent.
In the first sentence, Best-Painters’ is correct, but the meaning of the sentence is unclear. I suggest rewriting the sentence to simplify the meaning.
You do not need to use a possessive form in the next two sentences or the last sentence since “the Best-Painters” describes the community, website, and team. (A possessive would be formed if the were omitted.)
You agree not to send e-mails with viruses to the Best-Painters community.
Create an account using the Best-Painters.com site [or website].
Regards from the Best-Painters team.
The next sentence is incorrect. It should say:
Do you want to know more about Best-Painters’ services?
I have discovered that Facebook’s grammar checker is treating somebody’s else {noun} as correct, and somebody else’s {noun} as incorrect. In searching I found that several decades ago there was an ongoing debate among grammarians and editors throughout print media about which one would be correct. I see the grammatical sense in somebody’s else, since else modifies the noun. Somebody’s else book. What is your take on this? Is this an indication FB used a very old style manual, or is there a current formal style manual, such as the Chicago Manual, which is allowing for this?
I have never heard of the phrase “somebody’s else,” nor can I find anything in The Chicago Manual of Style that specifically addresses somebody else’s but we can get close. Chicago‘s rule states, “To form the possessive, the indefinite pronoun may take ‘s {that is no one’s fault} {Is this anyone’s jacket?} or the adverb else plus ‘s {don’t interfere with anybody else’s business} {no one else’s cups were broken}.”
3. The lass’s clothing showed her sewing skills.
How if I wrote this way: The lass’ clothing showed her sewing skills.
The rule in our blog “Apostrophes with Words Ending in “s” says, “To show singular possession for a word ending in an s or s sound, use the apostrophe and another s.” This represents American English rules and follows the Chicago Manual of Style.
I have a company name that is often abbreviated with an acronym. The company name is three words and ends with “Systems”… How do I show possession in this case? Should it be XYS’s or XYS’?
We recommend XYS’s.
My daugher is having a baby boy and she will spell his name Ja’mari is this corrected.
The correct spelling is that which is written on the child’s legal birth certificate.
I’ve been trying to figure this out for Arkansas. I’m wanting to put on my website: “…worked at Arkansas’ only Apple Specialist.”
Is it Arkansas’ or Arkansas’s?
Our Rule 2 in Apostrophes says, “Use the apostrophe to show possession. Place the apostrophe before the s to show singular possession. NOTE: Although names ending in s or an s sound are not required to have the second s added in possessive form, it is preferred.” Therefore, Arkansas’s is preferred. This is also consistent with The Chicago Manual of Style, which advises: “. . . words and names ending in an unpronounced s form the possessive in the usual way (with the addition of an apostrophe and an s). This practice not only recognizes that the additional s is often pronounced but adds to the appearance of consistency with the possessive forms of other types of proper nouns.”
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Thanks
Thank you for your compliment about our website. We are happy you think it will benefit those people who want to study the English language and that you plan to share it with your colleagues.
Thanks for this site.
I saw something recently that isn’t seen much anymore. Long ago there were just firemen, mailmen, etc. Now they are more commonly gender neutral – firefighters, mail carriers, etc.
I read the word “mailmen’s” recently and know it just seemed wrong. It needed to show the possessive & not just the plural. Similar to using children’s, which is just fine gramaticaly. Grammar check caught it too. Anyway I’m wondering if you just have to say it more formally – “the uniform of the mailmen” or if there is a correct way to use the apostrophe s.
Thanks for your help!
Our Rule 4 of Apostrophes is “To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.” Plural of mailman is mailmen. Thus, the plural possessive is mailmen’s. Grammar check programs are not always accurate.
The mailmen’s uniforms were blue. Or, in gender neutral terms, the mail carriers’ uniforms were blue.
Gives me problems all the time.
Is there not a case where there is not REAL ownership and we have a name with ‘s’ ending.
Hank Williams museum?
Hank Williams’ guitar. OK
Williams place in music history?
Hank Williams reputation? legacy?
This is a good example because you could use first name for clarity.
Hank’s reputation.
But still in real life in Williams is is hardly ever used.
correction already:: Williams’ is almost never used.
In the case of the Hank Williams Museum, since the museum is not actually owned by Hank Williams, the possessive form is not used. In the case of his guitar, place in music history, reputation, and legacy we do need to use the singular possessive form. The rule in our blog “Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z” (consistent with The Chicago Manual of Style) is, “To show singular possession of a name ending in s, ch, or z, use the apostrophe and another s.
Examples:
Bill Williams’s car
Harry Birch’s house
Mrs. Sanchez’s children”
However, The Associated Press Stylebook would use only an apostrophe.
Therefore, you may write Hank Williams’s guitar, Hank Williams’s place in music history, Hank Williams’s reputation, and Hank Williams’s legacy or Hank Williams’ guitar, Hank Williams’ place in music history, Hank Williams’ reputation, and Hank Williams’ legacy. Just be consistent.
Okay, I have just a quick question. I’m debating with the owner of my team, the Outlaws. Which is proper, my teammates and I are Outlaws’ players or Outlaw players? I am almost positive that we are Outlaws’ players. Thanks!
It appears that neither is correct.The Associated Press Stylebook says, “Do not add an apostrophe to a word ending in s when it is used primarily in a descriptive sense: citizens band radio, a Cincinnati Reds infielder, a teachers college, a Teamsters request, a writers guide.” Therefore, write “an Outlaws player,” or “Outlaws players.”
I am writing a letter about Macy’s (this is exactly how their company uses the apostrophe). I want to start a sentence with “As a part of Macy’s sponsorship..” would I leave it without any changes or would I make it “As a part of Macys’ sponsorship…”
Since Macy’s is a singular noun, write the word exactly how the company spells the name.
I thought this question was interesting! If “Macy’s” is the singular noun, though (e.g., I went to Macy’s to buy clothes.), wouldn’t the singular possessive be “Macy’s’s” (if we were following the rules). I know that look ridiculous, but the [singular noun]’s rule is being followed. The company policy is probably to just avoid the issue all together!
It is an interesting question. We think that Macy’s sponsorship is fine. In these situations, company brand names become a special type of collective noun. Writing a word with two apostrophes is overly slavish to the rules and extremely awkward. As George Orwell wrote in 1946 in Politics and the English Language, “Break any of these rules sooner than say anything outright barbarous.” A better option could be to rearrange the phrase to read a sponsorship of Macy’s department stores.
I need help. For my project, I ran into a problem with possesion. Is this right; The Philippines’s government.
The Chicago Manual of Style’s Rule 7.19 says, “When the singular form of a noun ending in s is the same as the plural (i.e., the plural is uninflected), the possessives of both are formed by the addition of an apostrophe only. If ambiguity threatens, use of to avoid the possessive.
politics’ true meaning
economics’ forerunners
this species’ first record (or, better, the first record of this species)
The same rule applies when the name of a place or an organization or a publication (or the last element in the name) is a plural form ending in s, such as the United States, even though the entity is singular.
the United States’ role in international law
Highland Hills’ late mayor
Callaway Gardens’ former curator
the National Academy of Sciences’ new policy”
Therefore, write the Phillippines’ government.
There is a battle in our house over a repeated invite to a pasta party our son received.
Quinn’s house is used repeatedly. Quinn is the last name. I have delicately answered the John is happy to attend the party at the Quinns’ house thank you.
I am just double checking I am correct.
You are correct as long as the location of the party is being referred to in the invitation as the house where the Quinns live, i.e., the Quinns’ house. However, if the location of the party is being referred to only as the place where your son’s friend lives, and, if he commonly is addressed by his friends as Quinn rather than by his first name, then the party could be at Quinn’s house (notice the absence of the in front of Quinn).
What about the princess who owns diamonds? Also what if she has two sisters who also own diamonds?
The rules above state, “To show singular possession for a word ending in an s or s sound, use the apostrophe and another s,” and “To show plural possession of a word ending in an s or s sound, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe.” Therefore, write the princess’s diamonds and the princesses’ diamonds.
I am so confused: my boss and I disagree on the use of the apostrophe on the word subsidiaries as used in the sentence below. Please clear up the argument for me.
Thanks.
Background Information:
Some clients (and their subsidiaries’) have recently requested that all of their documents be treated as highly confidential.
The word subsidiaries is not a possessive noun in your sentence; it is simply a plural noun. Therefore, no apostrophe is needed. However, if requests had come from subsidiaries of multiple clients, and the sentence were written using clients as an adjective, it would be: Some clients’ subsidiaries requested that all of their documents be treated as confidential.
Thank you – this has been very instructive. I worked in a technical discipline for many years. The writing styles of some colleagues was difficult to comprehend. I have had this apostrophe discussion on many occasions and someone would always cite some style guide or another. I’m sure I erred on occasion but always strove to get it right.
With regard to style guides, I suppose as used by publishers and newspapers, which are the most respected and most used for American English?
The Associated Press Stylebook is a highly respected and widely used style guide by American journalists.
I can follow most of these arguments – some seem obvious, some a little fatuous – but I am having trouble with a specific issue that is affecting me and I’d appreciate some advice.
I do some freelance writing about the football team West Ham United known as the Hammers. I often get pulled up by people commenting on my blogs regarding the use of the apostrophe. The Apostrophe Society itself has suggested that ‘I am a Hammers’s fan’ is the correct usage – something I find abhorrent – but even this supposedly definitive argument became disputed because of the issue of both possession and singularity. The Hammers are a team obviously but also it is a noun given to the club as a whole, the fans don’t own the club in real terms either but they belong to the club as fans. Are the Hammers a plural or a singular (I can make arguments for both).
No UK media outlet would ever use Hammers’s in any context anyway but even so I get confused over the usage in the following: “I am a Hammers fan” or “Buoyant Hammers fans are looking forward to a new season” or “the Hammers went on the attack early in the game”.
I note a comment above that you ‘do not add an apostrophe to a word ending in s when it is used primarily in a descriptive sense: a Cincinnati Reds infielder’ wouldn’t that then apply to a Hammers fan? I hope so – it would make my life easier! What do you think?
Since the Hammers are a team, I consider the word Hammers as falling into the category of collective nouns. Our blog Subject and Verb Agreement with Collective Nouns discusses in more detail the question of whether a team is singular or plural. It depends on the context of the sentence. If the team is acting as a unit, it is considered a singular noun.
The Associated Press Stylebook says, “Do not add an apostrophe to a word ending in s when it is used primarily in a descriptive sense: citizens band radio, a Cincinnati Reds infielder, a teachers college, a Teamsters request, a writers guide.” In American English usage this rule would also apply to “a Hammers fan,” which certainly looks and sounds a lot less awkward than “a Hammers’s fan.”
Plural possessive for noun ending with “ss?” Example, the Tess family picnic or the Tesses’picnic. What is the correct spelling?
The Tess family picnic or the Tesses’ picnic are both grammatically correct.
how will you read that??/ – CLASS’S – /classes/ or /class/ thanks
I’m sorry, but I find your question difficult to understand due to the overuse of symbols and lack of proper punctuation. I am going to guess that you are asking how to pronounce the word class’s, as in “The class’s preference is for a picnic on the last day of school.” It is pronounced the same as classes.
To those of you who purport the usage of “apostrophe s” after words ending in “s”, you are mistaken. I took English from a teacher educated at Oxford in England, I am an English major myself, and the “apostrophe s” after a word ending in “s” is a common error. The correct written form as well as speaking for for words ending in “s” is as if the word is singular possessive ie Jesus’, Chris’, Jess’. It is NOT Jesus’s, Chris’s, Jess’s. The second example is extremely poor use of the apostrophe to note singular possessive context. Yet it is commonly accepted as writers, authors etc. have not paid attention and do not know the “rules”.
There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent. The practices in England may differ from those in the United States
This argument is alive again with the new film “Lee Daniels’ The Butler”.
I think it is appropriate that the production company went with that over Lee Daniels’s The Butler, because we would not pronounce it Daniel-ziz.
I used to know a Daniels family, and you’d never say the Danielziz. You’d say the Daniels, no matter what.
In February 2014, a new edition of the Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation will be issued. A portion of Rule 1, Apostrophes, will state, “Many common nouns end in the letter s (lens, cactus, bus, etc.). So do a lot of proper nouns (Mr. Jones, Texas, Christmas). There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.”
In Friday Night Lights the two characters that are the Riggins brothers have a business.
Would Riggins’s Rigs
or
Riggins’ Rigs, be correct?
Things can get really confusing with the possessive plurals of proper names ending in s. Our Rule 4 of Apostrophes says,”To show plural possession, make the noun plural first. Then immediately use the apostrophe.” The plural of Riggins is Rigginses. To show possession, add an apostrophe. Although it may seem awkward, Rigginses’ Rigs is correct.
I am doing an online application for a University that I am really interested in, so I am triple checking every word, basically. So, I was wondering about the word campus and how I would show possession for that word, such as its environment. Please help.
In February 2014, a new edition of the Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation will be issued. A portion of Rule 1, Apostrophes, will state, “Many common nouns end in the letter s (lens, cactus, bus, etc.). So do a lot of proper nouns (Mr. Jones, Texas, Christmas). There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.” Therefore, you may write the campus’s environment, the campus’ environment, or the environment of the campus.
I’ve run into two sets of boots in an online game that read:
Hades’ Firestriders
Zeus’ Flamewalkers
Based on your post, it would seem to me that they should read:
Hades’s Firestriders
Zeus’s Flamewalkers
Which is the correct way? Thought I’d check before I go making a fool of myself for my rusty grammar. ;P
In February 2014, a new edition of the Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation will be issued. A portion of Rule 1, Apostrophes, will state, “Many common nouns end in the letter s (lens, cactus, bus, etc.). So do a lot of proper nouns (Mr. Jones, Texas, Christmas). There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.”
Wow, what an intriguing article! I have always kind of wondered what was really correct, so alright! Thanks!
We are glad you found our blog helpful.
In the book I am editing, one of the main characters (if you want to call it that) is a family funeral home belonging to a family named “Lowe.” When the author talks about a visitation at “Lowe’s,” is that the correct use of the possessive apostrophe?
Other examples: “…..hearse pulled in to Lowe’s driveway
“Lowe’s had never been that crowded in many years.”
Correct? or not?
If we were talking about a family named Lowe, they would be the Lowes and if we visited them we would be visiting the Lowes’ home. However, if a business is called Lowe’s, or Lowe’s Funeral Home perhaps, then your examples are correct.
How would the name Lars work?
Would it be Lars’ or Lars’s?
In February 2014, a new edition of The Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation will be issued. A portion of Rule 1, Apostrophes, will state, “There are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent. Some writers and editors add only an apostrophe to all nouns ending in s. And some add ’s to every proper noun, be it Hastings’s or Jones’s. One method, common in newspapers and magazines, is to add an apostrophe plus s (-’s) to common nouns ending in s, but only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s.”
Assuming that you are speaking about the possessive form for one person whose first name is Lars, either one of your options is correct.
An app of this incredibly helpful site would be wonderful.
That’s a good idea. Thank you for the suggestion.
I have carefully reviewed your lesson and want to confirm if I have got this all straight… :-)
Let us say the Smothers family was having a picnic at their campground when ants invaded. They fled the scene and went to a restaurant.
We just read about the Smothers’.
Ants ruined the Smothers’s picnic.
The flight of the Smothers’ was unavoidable.
I assume they piled into the Smothers’ Family car.
The Smothers’ wouldn’t recommend that park to others.
The Brooms’ picnicked there, with the Brooms’s dog Spot.
The others’ view of the Smothers departure was shock.
Ten families picnicked at those campgrounds but the Wenders’s site was clearly more ant-infested than the others’.
If you will be so kind, please approve or correct the grammar in the above statements. Thanks!
We just read about the Smotherses. (Do not use an apostrophe to make a name plural. Yes, this sounds awkward, but it is grammatically correct. You could also say, “We just read about the Smothers family.)
Ants ruined the Smotherses’ picnic. (If a name ends in s, add -es for the plural. Then to show possession, add an apostrophe.)
The flight of the Smotherses was unavoidable. (Same reason as first sentence.)
I assume they piled into the Smotherses’ family car. (Same reason as second sentence.)
The Smotherses wouldn’t recommend that park to others. (Same reason as first sentence.)
The Brooms picnicked there with the Brooms’ dog Spot. (Assuming the family’s last name is Broom, add s to make the plural and an apostrophe to show possession.)
The others’ view of the Smotherses’ departure was shock. (A bit awkward. Perhaps you meant “The others viewed the Smotherses’ departure with shock.”)
Ten families picnicked at those campgrounds but the Wenderses’ site was clearly more ant-infested than the others. (Assuming the family’s last name is Wenders, add -es for the plural and an apostrophe to show possession.)
One more… the family we just discussed (and their neighbours) are making decorative signs to hang at the front of their homes. Please show me the correct way to do such signs.
Are these grammatically correct possibilities, referring to the home the family lives in?
The Smith’s
The Smothers’
The Carlisles’
and what about these, referring to the families that live within?
The Smith Family
The Smothers Family
The Carlisles’ Family
if I were creating a sign to hang outside the home of the picnicking family just discussed, should the sign read “The Smothers Family”?
The Smiths’ [home] OR The Smiths [live here]
The Smotherses’ [home] OR The Smotherses [live here]
The Carlisles’ [home] OR The Carlisles [live here]
The Smith Family
The Carlisle Family
The sign could read “The Smothers Family.”
Christmas cards…’s or not? Is it “The Smith’s” or “The Smiths”? And on these cards what about if the name ends with an ‘s’, such as Buss ? Would it be “The Busses” ?
Since you are referring to a family (more than one person), it is a plural, not a possessive form. An apostrophe is not necessary. If a family’s name ends in s, we must add –es for the plural.
The Smiths
The Busses
How would a company name ending in the word Partners work as a possessive? For example, I’m working with this sentence…”Jones Real Estate Partners focus on dedicated, “best-of-class” management optimizes tenant loyalty.” Would Partners have s’ at the end?
In your sentence, the word Partners is a plural form, not possessive, therefore no apostrophe is needed. Also, it appears that a word might be missing from your sentence.
Jones Real Estate Partners focus on dedicated, “best-of-class” management that optimizes tenant loyalty.
One other detail you might consider: to our eyes, the hyphens in “best-of-class” are unnecessary because of the quotation marks.
This is an example of the word partners as a possessive:
Jones Real Estate Partners’ offices are being renovated next week.
Very Helpful
That is great.
I am someone who was taught that only an apostrophe was necessary for possessive nouns ending in s (both singular and possessive). Although it’s not recommended here, it’s still an acceptable policy as long as I remain consistent, correct?
Correct.
I serve as President of the Veterans Affairs Commission, City and County of San Francisco.
Some self-appointed experts insist that there should be an apostrophe at end of first word in title (i.e. Veterans’ Affairs Commission).
I say…not needed; not appropriate.
What say the experts?
Both The Chicago Manual of Style and The AP Stylebook agree on the term “Veterans Affairs” (as well as “Veterans Day,” no apostrophe in either case). While they are addressing the federal agency, we believe it would be safe to assume these two references would also endorse the terms in the case of the City and County of San Francisco.
The following rule is extracted from the Chicago Manual of Style:
The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively—to modify another noun—is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Although terms such as employees’ cafeteria sometimes appear without an apostrophe, Chicago dispenses with the apostrophe only in proper names (often corporate names) that do not use one or where there is clearly no possessive meaning.
children’s rights
taxpayers’ associations (or taxpayer associations)
consumers’ group (or consumer group)
but
Publishers Weekly
Diners Club
Department of Veterans Affairs
From The AP Stylebook:
Veterans Affairs Formerly Veterans Administration, it became Cabinet level in March 1989 with the full title Department of Veterans Affairs.
Would it be Jones’ and Smith’s Store or Jones and Smith’s Store?
If two people possess the same item, put the ’s after the second name only.
Jones and Smith’s Store
i have given my pen to my friend last night.that’s why i can’t bring it now.
I gave my pen to my friend last night. That’s why I can’t bring it now.
Very helpful but the “Lagos Airport” example is a great example of what I always found so frustrating about English grammar’s rules– their inconsistency. Following the advice in Rule 1, it make sense to write “Lagos’s Airport.” So why is “Texas’ weather” not written “Texas’s weather?”
I would appreciate it if you could advise whether I am misinterpreting the rule because, frankly, not knowing is driving me crazy and my productivity this morning has come to a screeching halt this morning!
If the need to apply the possession rule to a proper noun arises in the meantime, I will fall back on advice from the late James Kirkpatrick and circumvent the rule entirely by saying “The Lagos Airport.” or “the weather in Texas.”
Thanks.
Perhaps I answered ,y
You are correct that the answer to our quiz question could be changed to “We understand Lagos’s airport handled over one million passengers last year,” or “We understand Lagos’ airport handled over one million passengers last year.”
As we mentioned in our Rule 1, there are conflicting policies and theories about how to show possession when writing such nouns. There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent. Newspapers and magazines tend to want to save space, therefore preferring “Lagos’ airport” over “Lagos’s airport.” If space is not a concern, writing “Lagos’s airport” is acceptable.
This was very helpful, especially the pop quiz at the end. I don’t think I’ll ever get confused again :-) Thank you!
Thanks for the positive feedback.
Can you tell me if the following is correct please?
a maths’ test
a common/collective nouns’ recognition assessment
Thank you
Apostrophes are used to show possession. Your examples do not indicate the condition of having or owning anything. In American English, the word math is short for mathematics. Therefore, write:
a math test (American English) OR a maths test (British English)
a common/collective nouns recognition assignment
Which of the following is correct:
Feedbooks’s Terms of Use
Feedbooks’ Term of Use
Any help will be much appreciated.
Feedbooks is a singular proper noun that ends in s. Some writers and editors would add an apostrophe plus s to singular nouns ending in s. Others would add only an apostrophe.
GrammarBook.com says:
March 18, 2014, at 3:56 pm
(3rd post above)
“a common/collective nouns recognition assignment”
surely:
“a common/collective noun’s recognition assignment”?
An apostrophe would be incorrect as it implies possession. The nouns do not possess the recognition assignment. The phrase refers to a recognition assignment dealing with common and collective nouns.
In an initial reply, I saw you wrote, “being build on…”.
Should this not be ‘being built on’ or ‘having been built on’?
Perhaps you are referring to the comment from Jason of March 6, 2012. While we print comments from our readers as written, our responses will contain correct grammar and punctuation.
What is the rule or usage when the ending noun is left off as in: He went to the Stouts'(place)to see if they were home.
Assuming that the sentence refers to the house where the Stout family lives, the rule is the same as if the sentence read “He went to the Stouts’ house to see if they were home.” Since the name Stout does not end in s, to form the plural possessive, add s’.
He went to the Stouts’ to see if they were home.
Can you please help me to correctly place the apostrophe in the following sentence,
‘Also, Toms use of sarcasm is clear’
Would there be an apostrophe before/after the ‘S’ in ‘Tom’?
Thank you.
Since Tom is a singular noun, the possessive is Tom’s.
how are you .it is my first time to write to you I have some questions
choose
1 -Iwill meet you at the (supermarket’s-supermarket)car park.
2- do you want me to do (anything-something)dad?
3-She cannot find her mobile.Someone(must-may-might)have hidden it
In American English, the place where you park your car when you go to the supermarket is usually called a “parking lot.” If you are using the word supermarket as an adjective to describe the parking lot, no apostrophe is needed, but “supermarket’s” is also correct.
I will meet you at the supermarket parking lot.
Your second sentence should begin with a capital letter. Use a comma before or surrounding the name or title of a person directly addressed. Also, capitalize relatives’ family names (kinship names) when they are used alone in place of a personal name. Either anything or something is acceptable in your sentence.
Do you want me to do anything, Dad? OR
Do you want me to do something, Dad?
In your third sentence, “must,” “may,” and “might” are all grammatically correct, depending on what you mean. It is important to put the correct spacing between the words and sentences. In American English, we generally call them mobile phones or cell phones.
She cannot find her mobile phone. Someone must have hidden it. OR
She cannot find her mobile phone. Someone may have hidden it. OR
She cannot find her mobile phone. Someone might have hidden it.
Yesterdays’ sparring or yesterday’s sparring? Natures’ spring or Nature’s spring?
Since yesterday and nature are both singular nouns in those phrases, “yesterday’s sparring” and “nature’s spring” are correct.
How do you do?
I have a question,please.
Choose
If you ……… part in next year’s race. you should start training right now.
( have taken – takes – will take – took )
Since you are referring to the future, you could write “If you will take part in next year’s race, you should start training right now.” However, writing “will be” expresses the idea that a person plans to do something in the future. Therefore, the sentence below is a better option. Also, please note that there is a comma, not a period, since it is all one sentence.
“If you will be taking part in next year’s race, you should start training right now.”
Choose:
He prefers that she ……personally with him.
speak – speaks – is speaking- should speak
Please see our blog The Subjunctive Mood for our response.
I am happy to write to you again and I have 2questions, please
1- How much milk and butter (is – or – are )in the fridge?
2-I must have done my homework ,……….? ( Add tag question )
Please see our blog Subject and Verb Agreement with Collective Nouns for our response.
Is this correct: The Ministers’, Deacons’ and Trustees’ Wives of the SRBA-UD currently have the Rainbow Tea Banquet tickets for purchase. Tickets are $25.00 each.
Your apostrophes are correct, but we recommend writing:
The ministers’, deacons’, and trustees’ wives of the SRBA-UD currently have the Rainbow Tea Banquet tickets for purchase. Tickets are $25.00 each.
How would you properly use a subject showing possession of something else that is showing possession???
Ex: Katie’s father’s name
Katie is showing possession of her father, her father is showing possession of his name.
Your example is written correctly.
Would “Independents Day” be plural or singular? This day has no necessary correlation to the 4th of July.
I’m just wondering if, by definition, independents would be a group, spelled “independents’ ” which would make them dependent on the group, or simply a gathering of independents, spelled “independent’s”, to indicate the day singularly theirs.
No, I’m not trying to be a wise guy. It’s just something that crossed my inquisitive mind this morning under the influence of too much caffeine.
From The Chicago Manual of Style:
The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively—to modify another noun—is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Although terms such as employees’ cafeteria sometimes appear without an apostrophe, Chicago dispenses with the apostrophe only in proper names (often corporate names) that do not use one or where there is clearly no possessive meaning.
children’s rights
farmers’ market
women’s soccer team
boys’ clubs
taxpayers’ associations (or taxpayer associations)
consumers’ group (or consumer group)
but
Publishers Weekly
Diners Club
Department of Veterans Affairs
”in boss’s good book”..is it correct??
Most writers and editors add an apostrophe plus s to singular nouns ending in s. There are a few who only add an apostrophe. You might also consider adding the article the before “boss’s”: “in the boss’s good book.”
As you can probably tell from my name, I find this page very helpful.
We’re glad you find this page helpful, Mr. Hastings. We hope Mr. Jones does as well.
I think if the last word of the word is pronounced as “z” then there should be put a simple ‘ rather than putting an “s” after the ‘ . But on other occasions there should be ‘s to show possessive case.
The pronunciation of the word does not necessarily determine whether to use ‘s or only an apostrophe with words ending in s. Not all writers agree on which method to use. We suggest that you choose one method or the other and stay consistent.
Hi, my son’s name if Fergus. If I am talking about Fergus’ birthday, room, things etc should it be Fergus’ room or Fergus’s room? I think the former but everyone tells me I’m wrong. Thanks
As explained in our Rules 1b and 1c of Apostrophes, either is acceptable.
Going directly to my doubt.! {Never mind!! :D }
.
(ex:1) I just write, “Who’s there?”
Instead, “Who is there?”
.
Now.., when I had to go with some other question like;
(ex:2) “Who’s pen is this?”
Instead, “To whom does this pen belong?”
.
It’s not like; i cannot go to the second line directly. :/
But i prefer the first one over the second.! ;)
.
Now, just tell me which one is correct?
&also explain me, their usage if possible. (I request)
Thanking you by the way. ;)
In example 1, “Who’s there?” and “Who is there?” are both grammatically correct. Example 2 should be written “Whose pen is this?” The contraction who’s means “who is,” or “who has.” “To whom does this pen belong?” is also grammatically correct.
I have a new grandchild whose first name ends in “x.” Does the possessive form of her name require the apostrophe + s or just the apostrophe? The family is undecided. Thank you.
The possessive form of names ending in x are formed by adding an apostrophe plus s.
Let’s say a martial arts club has their own jargon terms for moves they use. Let’s say blackberry is a term for a choke hold that is applied to an opponent. How are these jargon terms pluralized? For instance the coach says to his students” I want to see a lot of blackberrys today.” Meaning chokes of course or would it be blackberries. Would these terms be considered proper nouns and pluralized as such. Or common nouns
The hypothetical word would not be a proper noun. It seems that it could fall under the category of a nickname. Typically, the plural of the word blackberry is blackberries. Of course, the dictionary defines the word as a fruit. To avoid that confusion, the coach could say, “I want to see a lot of blackberry moves today.” With Blackberry phones the plural would be Blackberrys. Perhaps the same would be applied to the martial arts moves.
Is medical jargon or terminology considered a common noun or proper noun. I suppose it would be the same for legal terminology as well. I want to know how to pluralize them. I know medical terminology has more than just s or es plurals why is that.
There is not a general rule that applies to all nouns that are considered medical or legal terminology. There are both common and proper nouns in both fields. Many of these words come from Greek or Latin words, therefore plurals may be formed uniquely.
Looking for help with the following sentence: “The claim constitutes a cloud on Plaintiff’s (or Plaintiffs’) respective titles, which Plaintiffs desire to remove.”
– more than one plaintiff, each own property individually, not collectively.
We are generally a bit hesitant to give advice in the legal realm, which has its own jargon. From your description of the situation, where you are dealing with multiple title holders, each of whom wants the same thing, we venture that either of the following sentences is correct:
“The claim constitutes a cloud on Plaintiffs’ respective titles, which Plaintiffs desire to remove.” OR
“The claim constitutes a cloud on Plaintiffs’ respective titles, which each Plaintiff desires to remove.”
Who came up with joneses? Last time I checked a proper name was proper. And jones was spelled jones. So who decided its ok to change a persons name make it grammatically correct?
Point being Jones Jones’ Jones’s but not joneses as you just changed someone’s name.
The plural form of the name Jones is Joneses, with a capital J. Writing “Joneses” indicates that more than one member of the Jones family is being referred to. Example:
The Joneses are flying in from New York tomorrow.
I am writing a paper about a guy named “Christmas” and I’m not sure how to use the ‘s rules.
For example:
“Christmas’ struggle is evident when he is traveling.”
Or
“Christmas’s struggle is evident when he is traveling.”
I am not sure if one way is better than the other. If you could help clarify this that would be great.
As we mention in Rule 1 of this grammar tip, “There is no right answer; the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.”
Glad I found the site! I have the grammar of an 11 year old compared to all of you I think but have a question as I’m working on designing an editors choice graphic. Would it be majorly incorrect to have it displayed as “Editors Choice”? Most sites display “Editors’ Choice” but even after reading the article above I’m not 100% sure why an apostrophe is necessary. Apostrophe’s make the design really look funky in my opinion so I’d love to avoid adding one but don’t want it to be ‘wrong’ either. Be easy on me folks, just trying to do things right. I’ll be sure to dive further into this site now that i know it’s here in hopes to learn more about proper grammar.
The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively—to modify another noun—is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Since the graphic is a choice of the editors, we recommend using an apostrophe to show possession.
Could you please tell me if I am correct in writing Creative Arts’ Day. I was told I was wrong but would just like to clarify. Thank you.
An apostrophe is not necessary since there is no possession indicated. You may also want to have a look at our blog “Confusing Possessives.”
Every time I look up things I need to know about writing my book, I always end up unknowingly clicking onto this site and OMG it really helps. Always so useful. Thank you!!!
I saw a question on Jeopardy! the other day, and it involved a letter followed by an apostrophe and an “s”. Don’t remember the exact question, but let’s just say it was; “How many a’s in the word aardvark”?
“A’s” is plural, not possessive in this case, so is there a special exception for showing an apostrophe for plural when it involves a single letter of the alphabet for example? If there was no apostrophe in the question it would have read “How many as in the word aardvark”?
Or, was the Jeopardy! question written incorrectly?
Thank you…
The question was written correctly. It’s a pragmatic and quite practical decision to write “A’s” because without the apostrophe you’d have the word As. Apostrophes are not necessarily possessive.
I want to ask that, can I use possessive s like that: e.g. `His father`s friend`s son`s wife is Russian.` Is it correct.
Thanks!
It is correct to do so. The writer will have to decide if it is wise to do so.
What is All with an apostrophe
Your question is difficult to understand, but we will take a guess that you mean an apostrophe plus s. The word all’s means “all is.” Example: All’s fair in love and war.
I am of the fifties years of learning the English. The language was not changed arbitrarily. (I do understand change) the times have changed is true. As Laura suggested, we are experiencing “a dumbing down”. Today, we are graduating children that cannot read and those that can read but not understand. It may be stylish to use “newer” spellings sounds, etc. but we have near 40% of people who cannot adapt well enough to read with understanding. Perhaps we are guilty of being part of the problem instead of the solution. Those same “acceptable manners” are not producing better offspring either. It is a lifestyle that needs examination for the sake of our future.
What if I want to name a store when people offer solutions. how it would be??
solution’s store? or solutions’s store??
Apostrophes are used to show possession. Your example does not indicate the condition of having or owning anything.
Also, the name of a store should be capitalized. Therefore, write “Solutions Store.”
It is very easy to learn.
First, I want to thank you for providing your services on this website. I have found it extremely helpful. I read through the first 25 comments and didn’t see the answer to the following questions. I apologize if they have already been asked. In this particular situation, I am married to a man who has the same first name and I took his last name. He typically goes by Jess and I go by Jessie. When people refer to items that belong to us, they use terms like The Jess’s house. They don’t use our last name as we’re better known for our unique situation with our first names. It feels like there are: 1) a lot of “s”s; and 2) as if they are referring to only one Jess since apostrophes typically go after the “s” in plural possessives. How would you refer to our house? My second question has to do with how I show my husband possesses something. How do I use the apostrophe with a name that ends with two “s”s like Jess?
We appreciate the positive feedback. To show plural possession of a word ending in an s or s sound, form the plural first; then immediately use the apostrophe. Therefore, the plural possessive is “the Jesses’ house.” The singular possessive is written either Jess’s or Jess’.
I help run a review site for bicycle trailers and wanted to make sure I have the grammar correct.
Should I use children’s bike trailers or childrens’ bike trailers?
The possessive for the irregular plural children is spelled children’s.
Please let’s eliminate the second “s” Our language is difficult enough. I just don’t see the need for it. It always looks pretentious to me.
Thank you for your site. It’s great!
Not sure what the best way to explain my question, but here it goes…..I’m using “(s)” in a sentence. How do I show that the (s) is possessive? Note: My focus is on the 2nd use of “owner(s) representative”.
For example: The property owner(s) or owner(s) representative(s) shall request inspection to verify compliance.
What is the best way to show that the owner(s) may have representatives?
For simplicity, we recommend: The property owner(s) or the representative(s) of the owner(s) shall request inspection to verify compliance. (We’re not lawyers, but you might want to consider may in place of shall.)
First, thank you for your website. It’s been very helpful to me. Second, if you answered this kind of question previously, I apologize. How would you handle Mr. Douglas:
When did you first observe the vehicle, the red Ford truck, that you described as Mr. Douglas’?
Your question can be interpreted in a couple of different ways. We are going to assume that you are a court reporter transcribing spoken words, and that this sentence could have been more clearly cast as When did you first observe the red Ford truck that you described as belonging to Mr. Douglas?
As we note in Rules 1b and 1c of Apostrophes, there are conflicting policies on how to show possession for singular nouns ending in s. The generic answer would be that it could be written either as Mr. Douglas’ or Mr. Douglas’s. However, for clarity in this case, we recommend “When did you first observe the vehicle, the red Ford truck, that you described as Mr. Douglas’s?”
I guess im old school bc i was taught anything ending with an “s” requires just an apostrophe & anything not ending in an “s” requires an apostrophe s. To me this makes life much EASIER. The last 2 or 3 generations are supposed to be about CONSERVING everything! The way i was taught above. uses less time, less thought, less ink, less space, less confusion.
Adding only an apostrophe to singular nouns that end in the letter s is no more traditional or time-honored than adding another s. The way you were taught was your teacher’s preference.
sorry
some poppycock and waffle’rules’
TO BE CLEAR (and consistent):
The possessive is formed by adding ‘s unless a word not only ends in S but is also PLURAL
movie: Bridget Jones’s Diary; Bridget is the Joneses’ daughter.
Don’t you say: boss’s office? actress’s role?
St James’s Street in London….
Ron Wood’s car, the Woods’ house;
Tiger Woods’s car; the Woodses’ house
Hope this helps and solves the mystery or confusion.
“Preferences” can lead to chaos and anarchy as well as loss of a rationale and consistency in international communication.
Either is correct as long as you actually say Elissez for both.
Wow this helps me a lot!! Thanks!
Which one is correct
Alixis’ Belongings
or
Alixis’s Belongings
Our post Apostrophes with Names Ending in s, ch, or z explains that both forms of the possessive of Alixis are acceptable. Unless Alixis’s Belongings is a title, the word belongings does not need to be capitalized.
Debate at work. Les Voies is our company’s name. We are launching something new. Which is correct: Les Voies’s or Les Voies’ e.g. Les Voies’s new system?
Les Voiles’s and Les Voiles’ are both acceptable.
This is an excellent source. I was taught in school always to leave the ‘s’ after the apostrophe out when the word or name ends in ‘s’, ‘x’ or ‘z’, but I had no idea the guidelines on this very much depends on where you are.
I noticed a mistake on your page though, and I suppose it’s something only a typographer would notice. In the fifth line of rule 1, the first apostrophe is upside down. This is an artefact from the digital keyboard. When you type an apostrophe first, it turns upside down to become a single quotation mark. Note however that apostrophes always point down. To type an apostrophe rather than a single quotation mark, type an arbitrary letter, then the apostrophe and then remove the arbitrary letter.
Thank you for your careful observation. We’ve fixed the apostrophes in both the fifth line and the eighth line.
How does the rule apply to General Motors?
Is it General Motors’s or General Motors’ ?
Thank you
Both options are acceptable.
I am writing a book on family history with lots of names in it but am concerned about putting the family names into plural.
Have I put the apostrophes in the right places for these families?
Short’s of Little Sutton
Ellis’s of Little Sutton
Jackson’s of Willaston
The Jackson and Wood Families.
Are these correct?
Many thanks.
Apostrophes are used to show possession. Your example does not indicate the condition of having or owning anything.
The Shorts of Little Sutton
The Ellises of Little Sutton
The Jacksons of Willaston
The Jackson and Wood Families.
We recommend you have a look at our blog post Apostrophes and Proper Nouns.
Our last name is De Vries.
How do I write our name on our Christmas card if I want to say, “From the De Vries___”? De Vrieses?
“From the De Vrieses” is correct but a bit unwieldy. You could also make it “From the De Vries family.”
Is the following sentence properly punctuated vis a vis apostrophes.
The Whitebears and the Cantrells are good friends.
Yes, your punctuation is correct.
Is the following sentence properly punctuated with apostrophes?
The meeting will be rescheduled upon Mr. Doe’s recovery.
Yes.
I was taught to write the foll:
WAS NOT abbreviated to: Was’nt
DOES NOT, in the same fashion to: does’nt
HAS NOT ditto to: has’nt
I then googled and read on a website , re: the apostrophe that this was INCORRECT because has’nt etc consists of TWO words so apostrophe should denote this and be placed between them: Does–not , so does’nt
Help: as I am now most puzzled? Please advise.
As per our Rule 5 of Apostrophes, “Use an apostrophe with contractions. The apostrophe is placed where a letter or letters have been removed.” Therefore write wasn’t, doesn’t, hasn’t, etc.
This is helpful!
If you’re still taking questions, I’d really like to know:
Can you tell me whether the possessive of Jesus, as in “in Jesus’ name, or “in Jesus’s name,” is an exception? Comes up all the time, both spoken and written. It always sounds awkward to me, when someone adds the extra syllable and says “in Jesus’s name.”
Also, I assume that the possessive for the Babylonian king Nabonidus is “Nabonidus’s,” correct? It may sound a little awkward when you’re adding more to a 3-syllable word, but the rule still applies, right? The extra “apostrophe s” helps with clarity, I think.
Thank you!
Up until recently it was standard practice to add only an apostrophe to form possessives of classical or biblical names, as in Jesus’ or Moses’ or Aristophanes’. Today, most authorities recommend adding an apostrophe plus s to such names, whether you would choose to pronounce the extra syllable or not.
In the case of Optimus Prime, what would be proper?
“Optimus’s matrix” or “Optimus’ matrix” ?
Either is acceptable, but we prefer to write the word as we would speak it. Therefore, we recommend writing Optimus’s matrix.
I seem to remember a rule that one adds apostrophe-s to form the possessive of a one syllable noun ending in s, but only an apostrophe to form the possessive of a noun with more than one syllable. Did such a rule ever exist? I have heard readers of poetry wreck the meter by adding an s to the possessive of a name like Ulysses.
Your memory may not be playing tricks on you. For certain items, we will consult references beyond The AP Stylebook and The Chicago Manual of Style.
Concerning possession with endings in “s,” Harbrace College Handbook offers the following direction that may be helpful:
– If the plural ends in an “s” or a “z” sound, add only the apostrophe (ladies’ gloves, the Joneses’ gardens, three dollars’ worth).
– If the singular ends in an “s” or “z” sound, add the apostrophe and “s” for words of one syllable. Add only the apostrophe for words of more than one syllable unless you expect the pronunciation of the second “s” or “z” sound (the boss’s desk, Moses’ brother, Eloise’s letters).
Our recommendation is contained in the last paragraph of our Rule 1c of Apostrophes:
… write the word as we would speak it. For example, since most people saying “Mr. Hastings’ pen” would not pronounce an added s, we would write Mr. Hastings’ pen with no added s. But most people would pronounce an added s in “Jones’s,” so we’d write it as we say it: Mr. Jones’s golf clubs.
I am purchasing a wedding gift for a couple with the last name “Fox”. The engraving will read “The Foxes Kitchen”. Should an apostrophe be added on the end to show possession? e.g.”The Foxes’ Kitchen”
Yes.
Not seeing the point raised previously I have to wonder about your answer to Pop Quiz question 5.
Just as the late J.F. Kennedy never owned the place you cannot write John Franklin Kennedy’s(or JFK’s)airport so ‘Lagos’ is an adjective defining the airport at Ikeja. Therefore it should not have an apostrophe in either place.
Just as we would write New York’s JFK airport, we would also say Lagos’s or Lagos’ airport (or Lagos’s Murtala Muhammed International airport).
My Son, also Joe and I have a restaurant. We have been calling it Joes’ BBQ. Is that the correct way? Thanks
Yes.
My sister’s new last name is Michels. If I follow the rules above it would be Michelses for the sentence- “I am going over to the Michelses house.” It is quite hard to say and it sounds wrong. I’m not sure if it’s because of the ls at the end or what it is. Can you shed any light on this?
If someone’s name ends in s, we must add -es for the plural. In formal writing, this rule must be followed no matter how strange or awkward the results.
Your example sentence uses a possessive form of the name, therefore an apostrophe is used. “I am going over to the Michelses’ house.”
Excuse me, shouldn’t the possessive form only be applied when the owners are people, animals, cities/nations and expressions of time?
Why then “canvas’s size” and “bus’s steering wheel’?
We like this answer from the Chicago Manual of Style:
Q. I’m trying to find a definitive answer to whether an inanimate object can take the possessive form. I have been told that an object cannot possess something, so the ’s form should not be used. Instead of “the vehicle’s speed,” it should be “the speed of the vehicle.” I understand the rule, but can’t find anything here to support it.
A. We seem to be having a run on questions that turn on the issue of literal word usage. But let’s think about it. If a table can’t “have” legs, where does this leave us? True, the table is probably not conscious that it possesses legs, but then does that mean it doesn’t truly possess them? If a table possesses legs in the forest, where there’s no one to see them . . . oh, wait—that’s another riddle. Seriously, I’d love to know who makes up these rules, seemingly just to drive everyone crazy. Don’t worry—your vehicle can have speed, and there’s no difference between the speed of the vehicle and the vehicle’s speed (or “vehicle speed,” if you prefer to avoid the controversy).
What is the plural form of an acronym that ends in ‘S’? For example DBMS. (Database Management System)
The plural of DBMS is generally written DBMSs.
Ok, so if I wanted to write something as belonging to more than one say, dog, it would be written as “the dogs’ bone,” if you had more than one dog and they collectively owned the bone?
Yes, that is correct.
Should we add ‘s to supermarket when I said we will meet at 7 at supermarket car park?
It would be more common in American English to say, “We will meet at 7 at the supermarket’s parking lot.”
“The class’s hours”? Are you sure? So, if we were talking about the syllabus, you would say “the class’s syllabus” for a sentence with 4 “s” in a row? I prefer the rule that gives priority to the way things sound when we speak them out. What is your preference in this case?
Yes, we are sure that “the class’s hours” and “the class’s syllabus” are both grammatically correct. As implied by our Rule 1 in this post, that is our preference.
what goes around comes back.why comes carry s
The saying is “What goes around comes around.” In this sentence what is a third-person singular pronoun. Therefore, both verbs, goes and comes, have an added s.
If I’m saying “cheers to all the moms going back to school.” Does moms have an apostrophe after it? EX: moms’
No, a simple plural does not use an apostrophe. Use moms in your sentence.
If I am listing family names after “Love,” do the last names need an apostrophe? For example: Love, Smith’s, Harper’s, and Keiser’s
No, simple plurals do not require an apostrophe.
I found an error in the example given in the following rule:
Rule 7. Amounts of time or money are sometimes used as possessive adjectives that require apostrophes.
Incorrect: my two cents worth
Correct: my two cents’ worth
The correct and incorrect should be reversed. This phrase refers to the value of my opinion or input, not that the two cent possesses the worth. This would be more clearly written as: my two-cents worth.
Thanks for allowing me to give mine!
We disagree. Our example is referring to the worth of two cents. The phrase is possessive and requires an apostrophe. We do not believe you will find any style manuals or authoritative sources to substantiate your opinion.
I am creating a family plaque for the name Harkness. It will have a quote Saying “The Harkness Kitchen” do I need an apostrophe?
“The Harkness Kitchen” is fine. You could also write “The Harknesses’ Kitchen.”
“The Peace Corps’ mission is to help the needy.”
or is it:
“The Peace Corps’s mission is to to help the needy.”
A case could probably be made for both. The Associated Press Stylebook advises Corps’, and this is the form that is more common in the media by far.
why I find sentences like world`s biggest airport , but I do find world`s war 2 for example, only wold war 2.
also in case of question,
Is your dog`s collar safe? is not collar a possessive of the dog? or of me.
while in normal writing it is your dog collar is safe.
i found at one of your replies up here you can write supermarket`s parking. how could the supermarket possessive?
I am sorry but possessives for unthinking nouns make me confusing.
thank you for your great efforts.
The phrase “world’s biggest airport” refers to the biggest airport of the world. Therefore, it is a possessive phrase. World War II is a proper noun and does not require an ‘s. It is usually written with a Roman numeral. The sentence “Is your dog’s collar safe?” refers to the collar of the dog. Your last example refers to the parking lot of the supermarket. A possessive phrase can refer to a non-living thing.
My name ends with s so it’s correct if I say Anubis’ car or something like that or I have to add the s like Anubis’s car?
To show singular possession of a name ending in s or z, some writers add just an apostrophe. Others also add another s. See Rules 1b and 1c of Apostrophes for more discussion.
Which is correct?
Welcome to Grandparents’ and Special Friends’ Day (s apostrophe), or,
Welcome to Grandparents and Special Friends Day (no apostrophe).
Unfortunately, in American English there seems to be no consistency when it comes to apostrophe placement in holiday names. Therefore, either one is acceptable (also see our post Confusing Possessives).
Please assist with this sentence i’m having ongoing confusion with. Which one is correct to use to indicate the organisation the researcher works for.
The researcher selected three of his organization’s core business operations in Africa
The researcher selected three of his organizations’ core business operations in Africa
If you are referring to only one organization, organization’s would be correct. You also need a period at the end of the sentence.
This is another one i’m struggling with.
The projects selected across the organization’s African remote site Operations were selected specifically for…
The projects selected across the organizations’ Angolan remote site Operations were selected specifically for….
Also should there be an apostrophe by the word “projects”
No, a simple plural does not need an apostrophe. Also, the word operations should not be capitalized.
If you are referring to one organization, the sentence should read like this: The projects selected across the organization’s African remote site operations were selected specifically for…
Thanks. I was taught by an English teacher a long time ago that, if a proper noun ends in n it shows ownership, add ‘s because the s on the end of a person’s name belongs to the person, therefore add s’ to show ownership eg, Watkins’s College. What about it? Correct or not?
To show ownership or possession of a singular proper noun that ends in s, adding ’s is correct, however, some writers and editors add only an apostrophe to all proper nouns ending in s. Therefore, Watkins’s College and Watkins’ College are both acceptable. Please see our Rule 1c of Apostrophes.
If I write under Mr Stephens’s leadership, is that correct? Do I add an extra s with apostrophe or just add the apostrophe after the s? Surname ends with an s.
Either Stephens’s or Stephens’ is fine, as per our Rule 1c of Apostrophes.
We are sending out an invitation. Our last name is Kreis. Would we say, “The Kreises’ house” or “The Kreis’ House.”
Thank you.
“The Kreises’ house.” Whether “The” is capitalized depends on the context.
If I was trying to reference a guild of workers, would I simply use “workers guild” without the apostrophe? My co-workers and I are split on this because nobody is sure whether or not it should be considered possessive.
Thanks in advance for the help.
The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively—to modify another noun—is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Since you have a guild of workers, you could write workers’ guild. However, some writers prefer to use the word workers as an adjective describing the word guild and omit the apostrophe. Please see our posts Confusing Possessives and Apostrophes and False Possessives for more information.
Is it Mrs. Klones’s house or Mrs. Clones’ house?
As discussed in Rule 1 above, either Mrs. Klones’s house or Mrs. Klones’ house is acceptable.
I find the example toward the end about apostrophes added to common and proper nouns ending in “s” confusing, as it says that many times it is written as it is spoken. The example given is of a last name “Hastings.” When I think of the way I want people to say a plural form of Hills, I don’t want to hear, “Hills.” I want to hear “Hills-es,” otherwise, I think they are saying Hill-s.
What we are saying about pronunciation applies only to singular possession. The plural of the name Hills is Hillses. Thus, an example of plural possession would be The Hillses’ daughter. Now let’s look at the singular case: would Kayla be Kathy Hills’ daughter or Kathy Hills’s daughter? Either one is grammatically correct. If it were up to us, we would write Hills’s.
Thank you for your excellent newsletter.
The term T’s & C’s for terms and conditions often provoke heated debate whether the apostrophe should be used or the term written as Ts & Cs.
Yes, we imagine this can provoke heated debate, probably because there is no universally accepted rule or guideline on this situation. Please see our Rule 6 of Apostrophes. We didn’t want to ignore the form entirely, but the sentence “Many writers and editors prefer an apostrophe after single capitalized letters” was the best we could do because of differing guidance between the leading style manuals. We at GrammarBook.com tend to omit the apostrophe unless there could be misunderstanding about a term, e.g., Ts and Us.
Thank you for the kind words.
In today’s Grammar newsletter – you used the words “the best advice is to choose a formula and stay consistent.”
To me – the use of “stay consistent” sounds redundant.
If you’re consistent, you are staying the same.
How about:
1) “be consistent”
2) “stay with it”
That is an interesting point; you are a careful reader.
Could you help me out?
Olympus’ or Olympus’s?
Which is better?
Neither is necessarily better, however the technique we favor is to write the word as we would speak it. Therefore, we prefer to write Olympus’s.
Which one is correct?
A: Drones comparison
B: Drones’ comparison
C: Drone’s comparison
We need to see the phrase used in a complete sentence to make a recommendation.
A friend is writing on BridgE (the game) and has written “the oppositions’ bidding system…”. I have suggested that this should be either:
“the opponents’ bidding system…” (plural), or
“the opposition’s bidding system…” (assuming “opposition” is a singular noun).
Would this be correct?
Since the appropriate definition of the noun opposition in your term is “a body of persons opposing something,” it seems that the word is singular. Therefore, your suggestions are correct.
My question is, two kids own a book they share, their names are Izzy and Lucas. So is it correct to say,
Izzy and Lucas’ book?
Or is it Izzy and Lucas’s book? I am so confused.
You really are not that confused. You are correct that when two people share ownership, the possessive goes after the second name only. Either Izzy and Lucas’s or Izzy and Lucas’ book is correct. We prefer Lucas’s since that’s how we would pronounce it.
so I was wondering which of these statements would be correct,
Both John’s are mine
or
Both Johns are mine
While we don’t understand the context, if you are speaking of two individuals named John, no apostrophe should be used.
Hope someone can help.
Is it “young philosophers’ club” or “young philosophers club”?
Thank you!
The line between a possessive and a noun used to modify another noun is sometimes fuzzy, especially in the plural. Since you have a club of young philosophers, you could write young philosophers’ club. However, some writers prefer to use the word philosophers as an adjective describing the word club and omit the apostrophe. Please see our posts Confusing Possessives and Apostrophes and False Possessives for more information.
Apostrophes
What about cases such as this: the old people’s home
It is not the home of the old people, but for the old people (dative, not genitive)
The terms old people’s home and old folks’ home are commonly accepted expressions.
Hey I’m really confuse about when to do the apostrophe with words ending in s and stuff like that. Like, which is grammatically correct class’s or class’. Here’s an example of a sentence from my SAT book.
Before the holiday, the World Literature professor assigned the classes’ next novel, Don Quixote.
A) NO CHANGE
B) class’
C) class’s
D) classes
Assuming that the professor teaches only one world literature class, answer “C) class’s” is correct. You will find thorough explanations in our posts Apostrophes and Apostrophes: Worth the Trouble. You may also wish to study our rules for apostrophes.
if i write susans photos looked really good where would I put the apostrophe
Susan’s photos looked really good.
Do you write out (when a group of people is thanking a group of staff members “There is nothing but gratitude in our ( the group’s) hearts toward all of you ! Or, do you write “There is nothing but gratitude in our (the groups’) hearts towards all of you ! What desires to be conveyed is that each individual heart of the group, has gratitude inside of it. Or, do you just assume that a group of individuals own one heart together, collectively ? Or even, do you say in our (the groups) hearts’ toward all of you ? This comes under the concept of a collective noun, apparently.
The group is acting together, thus the word group is singular. Since the group is made up of multiple members, there are multiple hearts. To us, the simplest expression would be to assume that the group is understood:
There is nothing but gratitude in our hearts toward all of you!
Which would you think is better:
Analysis and virtualization of global events’s effects on currency fluctuations.
or
Analysis and virtualization of global events’ effects on currency fluctuations.
or is it better to re-structure the sentence:
Analysis and virtualization of effects of global events on currency fluctuations.
As a non-native speaker I feel the 2x of in a row sounds a bit odd?
or is there a 3rd way I’m missing that removes the 2x of and the events’s
First, we assume that you are writing titles or headings of some kind as they are not complete sentences. We prefer your restructured version without the apostrophes. If it is to be a title, we suggest your see our post Titles of Books, Plays, Articles, etc.: Underline? Italics? Quotation Marks? for more information.
Need some help, didn’t know if the below was correct.
I will be assisting on James’ behalf.
Either James’ or James’s is acceptable.
I am trying to assign possession to a business, the name of which ends with ‘s, e.g. Martin’s … in this example, I want to say “Martin’s’s compliance.” I know the double apostrophe is incorrect. What is the correct way to do this? Thank you.
Please see our response of July 1, 2013, to Felicia.
Can you please tell me if this is right?
– Those are men’s coats
– What is your street’s name?
– What is your brother’s name?
-That’s Luis’s hat
Thatk you very much
If periods are added to the end of the first and fourth sentences, they are all correct.
Love this article! It really attracts the grammar nit-picker in me.
I know in the case of missing letters, we Apostrophyze. E.G. “old” = “ol'”; “come on back” = “‘mon back” (wild Southern absurdity). But does this also hold true for numbers? E.G. “1990s” = “’90s” or “90s”? I have always used the Apostrophes in such cases, but I was never sure if there was a rule.
I guess it follows the missing letters rule, but what can you say about ridiculous cases such as “Poos’n’boots”, with regards to spacing and capitalization?
Our Rule 11 of Writing Numbers recommends writing ’90s when expressing the 1990s with missing numerals. Though we feel it is misdirected and unnecessary, we do acknowledge that some writers use 90’s. We discourage expressions such as ’90’s.
We’ve generally seen the centuries-old fairy tale and more recent movie title written as “Puss in Boots.” We agree that using apostrophes is ridiculous because nothing is gained. “Puss ‘n Boots” simply substitutes an apostrophe for an i, and “Puss ‘n’ Boots” seems to misinterpret the title as “Puss and Boots.”
I have what I feel is a rare situation. I’m working with an association that produces documents for buyers. The documents are called Buyers Guides. Since these documents are not named with intended possession, does the name require an apostrophe?
Which is correct?
Buyers Guides
or
Buyer’s Guides
I appreciate your help in this conundrum.
Thank you.
The word Buyers could be considered either a possessive plural noun (Buyers’) or an adjective describing the word Guides (Buyers). See our posts Apostrophes and False Possessives and Confusing Possessives for more information.
When I am using a quote in a plural situation, would I write “too hot”s, “too hot”‘s, or is it incorrect to do this at all? I am using Goldilocks “too hot”, “too cold”, and “just right” as a metaphor for several situations in this writing.
It sounds like you are referring to simple plurals with no apostrophe: too colds, too hots, just rights (note that the letter “s” in each case is not in italics). Alternatively, you could consider recasting to something like “Goldilocks uses just right three times.”
What about McDonald’s? If you want to write: “It isn’t just McDonald’s’ fault that 70 percent of the US population is fat or obese.”? Are the apostrophes correctly placed here?
Writing a word with two apostrophes is awkward. Writing the company brand name McDonald’s in your sentence would be acceptable; however, a better option could be to avoid the possessive form and write “the fault of McDonald’s.”
Which one is right?
“Douglas’s socks/ Douglas’ Socks”
When the noun starts in S right after the possessive S
The noun following the possessive word has nothing to do with the apostrophe. If you are referring to one person whose name is Douglas, either option is acceptable. We prefer writing the word as we would speak it, Douglas’s. We see no reason to capitalize the word socks unless it is part of a title.
Writing about company rules… is “ACME rules on behavior” correct or must it be “ACME’s rules on behavior”? I find “City rules” used in many locations on the net, however, there are people here who insist it must be “City’s rules”.
Using either the possessive “ACME’S rules” or the word “ACME” as an adjective to describe “rules” would be a matter of preference. Both are grammatically correct.
What about using contractions with words ending in s? Chris is installing the pipe.-, Chris’s installing the pipe, Chris’ installing the pipe?
Although it might be acceptable when speaking, in formal writing we recommend writing “Chris is” instead of using a contraction in this sentence to avoid confusion. If you had to write it in a quotation, although we would avoid doing so, you would write “Chris’s installing the pipe.”
1a) “Some writers and editors add ’s to every proper noun, be it Hastings’s or Jones’s.” –> implies this rule <>, doesn’t it?
1b) “One method, common in newspapers and magazines, is to add an apostrophe plus s (’s) to common nouns ending in s, but only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s.”
1c) Your prefered one:
Just change 1b in the proper-noun-rule part:
Depending on pronunciation a proper noun gets an ’ or ’s.
The rule for the common-noun part remains the same, doesn’t it?
My Question:
First: Did I recap the facts correctly?
Middle: Can I construct a rule 1d? Actually the combination of 1a and 1b?
1d) Every single noun, proper or not, gets a ’s?
I prefer this rule, because it delivers extra information:
If one reads “xxxs’s,” he can defer for sure that the possessing noun
is singular. Whereas by applying rule 1c uncertanty remains.
How common is rule 1d in real life? Nearly as common to rule 1c?
Last: Do you know about the most common rule for British English?
This kind of stuff makes me nerdier than before. Thank you for your inspiration.
Using the apostrophe to show possession is a complex area. As you astutely noticed, constructing clear rules to guide our readers through all of the possibilities was no easy task. Although not all of what you wrote is correct (e.g., note that your Rule 1d is in conflict with examples in our Rule 1c), we appreciate the attempt at clarification. We are just now embarking on revising the 11th edition of The Blue Book of Grammar and Punctuation, and we will be looking at simplifying and clarifying these rules.
How does the company name that already ends in an apostrophe get pluralized, e.g. Lowe’s?
Would it be Lowe’s’ or Lowe’ses or just Lowe’s?
The spelling of the company name is Lowe’s, which ends in an s. Using the rules for words ending in s, writing the plural Lowe’ses is awkward indeed. A better option would be to avoid the plural form and write There are a few Lowe’s stores in town.
When I am using a quote in a plural situation, would I write “too hot”s, “too hot”‘s, or is it incorrect to do this at all? I am using Goldilocks “too hot,” “too cold,” and “just right” as a metaphor for several situations in this writing. Please explain.
You appear to be referring to simple plurals, which need no apostrophe. We don’t know the exact context of what you intend, but you may be able to get around an awkward use of quotation marks by using italics that do not include the pluralizing s: too hots.
Coaches’ conference or
Coaches Conference
Not sure which to use on conference brochure.
If this is a conference for coaches, the plural possessive Coaches’ Conference is written correctly. Some writers would leave the apostrophe out, with the thought that Coaches is used as an adjective describing the word Conference. Please see our post Apostrophes and False Possessives for more information.
For non-living objects we don’t use ’s to show possession, do we?
“The handle of the chair is broken,” not “the chair’s handle.”
Please clarify.
Thanks.
It is normally acceptable to use ‘s to show singular possession for inanimate objects.
Which one is correct, the Philippines’ government or the Philippines’s government ? Or both are acceptable?
Your example is a good fit for the rule of adding only a stand-alone apostrophe to proper nouns ending in s. We’d write the Philippines’ government or the government of the Philippines.
Is it “proving Fowles’s claim” or “proving Fowles’ claim”?
As the post states, “Some writers and editors add ‘s to every proper noun, be it Hastings’s or Jones’s. And there are a few who add only an apostrophe to all nouns ending in s—however, this method is relatively rare, and not recommended here.”
We are having an argument. Can I write “No, actually they’re Martins darling, he likes to wear them,” without using an apostrophe for Martins?
Many thanks.
If you are referring to the Dr. Martens brand of shoes (also referred to as Doc Martens), you would not include a possessive apostrophe:
No, actually they’re [Doc or Dr.] Martens, darling; he likes to wear them.
In the sentence “It was the highest achievement of Mr Jones career,” would this be an example of Jones’s or Jones’?
Thank you for your assistance.
As the post indicates, either one is grammatically acceptable.
I’m confused about the following question which is: Under what is the influence of the S ending in the plural of nouns, the third person singular of S.present and in the possessives cases in three different ways!!!
We would ask for clarification. The question is unclear.
Thank you for this resource. I came here because old rules die hard. I noticed that autocorrect was changing it to agree with you, and as that caused a dissonance for me, I came to check for correctness.
What if the item of possession is not included? As in “Welcome to the Cates (house),” Cates being the surname and “house” left out. Cates’, Cates’s, Cateses or just Cates?
Use the plural possessive “Welcome to the Cateses’.”
To be clear:
In legal writing, the Souter approach (possessive = ‘s after everything–including words ending in s–unless it’s Biblical or Classical) is the only acceptable approach.
In truth, the Souter approach should be the preferred method, regardless, since the following all say this is standard:
The Elements of Style;
The Chicago Manual of Style;
A Dictionary of Modern Legal Usage;
Fowler’s Modern English Usage;
U.S. Government Printing Office, Style.
It is also included as a rule in Georgetown University Law Center’s guide for effective punctuation in legal writing.
In fact, the only manual that allows for the dropping of the s after the apostrophe in any writing is The Associated Press Stylebook. However, Wilson Follett’s Modern American Usage is fine with either (which isn’t saying much about its reliability, rule-wise).
Furthermore, in legal writing, when in doubt refer to usage in SCOTUS Opinions. It could be the difference in looking like a hack to seasoned attorneys or looking knowledgeable.
For example, in a recent poll Westlaw took of currently licensed and practicing attorneys, 65% of of those under the age of 45 stated they believe the word “pled” is a valid legal term (it is not) and use it in their pleadings and writings. The proper term, of course, is “pleaded.” Pled is a word, but not a legal term.
I run a law firm and tell my new associates, “When in doubt, refer to SCOTUS.” In the entire existence of the Supreme Court of the United States, apparently no Justice has ever used the word “pled.” The only exception for this is when Justices have been required to cite a direct quote from a source that incorrectly used it.
An official is a “Team Leader.” There is a meeting run by the organizers of the event for the Team Leaders from each country.
On the competition schedule should this be listed as
Team Leaders Meeting
or
Team Leaders’ Meeting?
It looks a little odd with the apostrophe as the header for the papers for the meeting and in the schedule on the website.
Thanks for your help.
The line between a possessive or genitive form and a noun used attributively is sometimes fuzzy. Whether you use the possessive Leaders’ or the word Leaders as a descriptive adjective to modify the noun Meeting is a matter of style and preference. Either is grammatically correct. See our post Apostrophes and False Possessives.
What is the correct use of the apostrophe in “Weights and Measures Official”?
Is it “Weights and Measures’ Official”?
Or, is it just “Weights and Measures Official”; or …?
Thank you for your assistance with this.
If you are describing a position in a formally titled division or department, we would treat “Weights and Measures” as a capitalized proper noun phrase and “official” as a lowercased descriptive title: “Weights and Measures official.” Also refer to our posts Capitalization of Job Titles and When to Capitalize People’s Titles.
Mr. Davis account
Its the companys aim to help our consumers
Our consumers expectations are extremely high
The following are grammatically correct:
Mr. Davis’s account
It’s the company’s aim to help our consumers.
Our consumers’ expectations are extremely high.
How do you make a proper noun possessive when it is possessive to begin with? If I have a recipe from Melvin’s BBQ — generally known as Melvin’s — and I want to create a title for it, would it be Melvin’s, Melvin’s’, or even Melvin’s’s Mustard Sauce Recipe? And, by extension, would the correct punctuation when using the entire name be Melvin’s BBQ’s Mustard Sauce?
Some may argue that “Melvin’s’s’ Mustard Sauce Recipe” or “Melvin’s BBQ’s’s Mustard Sauce” could be technically correct; however, it looks awkward and confusing. Where possible, we recommend a rewrite to avoid the possessive case: Melvin’s BBQ Mustard Sauce, Melvin’s BBQ Mustard Sauce Recipe. See our post Apostrophes and False Possessives for more information.